posted
I've been to a handful, the last time over 3 years ago. Generally speaking, I'll agree with those who note it's kinda like paying for someone to pretend to be interested in me - kinda like walking out of a Hooters actually thinking your waitress was interested in you.
My favorite (awkward) strip club moment was at one in Toronto on my 21st or 22nd birthday. My friend paid for a lap dance for me. I was a little turned off by the whole thing, but also a little excited by "breaking a taboo". I had my keys in my front pocket and I think the poor girl bruised herself on them - not the hard object she had been expecting to bounce on. It was a short lap dance and we just chatted a bit before heading back to my group of friends.
I moved to Vegas about 4 years ago and have only been to 1 out here once for my bachelor party. I have no current plans to return.
I won't say they don't have a certain appeal to a heterosexual guy. But I've got more important things to spend my money on, and things I enjoy spending an evening doing more.
Posts: 1295 | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
I worked at a company in the Odd entertainment industry. While I still do--Magic and Juggling and such--before it was even sillier.
As a result I have a few strip club stories.
Like the strip club that called looking to rent Sumo suits. Thats suits people get into to fake sumo wrestle. When we informed them that there would be a mandatory cleaning bill they dropped the idea. (They bought there own Giant Boxing Gloves).
Then there is the bright red that the owner turned every time he gets asked to perform magic at a strip club. His wife won't let him because she believes he'll die of embarrassment.
Then there was the manager who planned to take the boss to "this cool stip club" when they were at a convention in Atlanta. It was going to be a surprise. Boy was it. 5 days before they arrived the "cool" strip club was raided and closed. The management was arrested for credit-card fraud. They liked to add 0's to drunk horny guys bills, because drunk distracted guys apparently don't notice when there $100 night becomes a $1000 night. Or they are too embarrassed to make a complaint. That tactic doesn't scale well apparently. The guy who had a $35,000 bill for what was a $3,500 party figured it was worth his wifes wrath to save $32,000. So he went to the police.
Then there was the warehouse guy who called missed a bunch of work. Seems he started dating a stripper. She convinced him not to mind her job. However, when she started bringing big tipping customers home for more unauthorized services the boyfriend complained. Violence ensued. The stripper won.
Then there was the strange hippy-wanna-be who was our first warehouse person. He was big into free-love. Then he discovered that the strippers really liked the cheap temporary tattoos we used at parties. For months he was a very happy worker, and our temporary tattoo stock seemed to vanish.
But finally there was the one time I, out of curiosity, stopped in a strip club during a convention. The place was empty except for the bartender, a not very pretty woman in very little clothing--zonked out of her skull, and a bossy man with a cane that screamed "pimp". As I stepped into the room he yelled at the girl--"Dance woman". Music blared out and she zombie-walked on the bar/stage. I turned around and went elsewhere.
Posts: 1941 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Originally posted by breyerchic04: Kwea, where are you living now? I thought it was Ocala and I can't imagine they only have one strip club.
Yep, that's where I live. They may have more than one, but I am pretty sure they don't. Not that I care either way. Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
Your not really paying for boobs, as a matter of fact you are currently looking at infinite portal to free boobs.
When a guy is in a strip club hes handsome, funny, interesting and wanted... until he runs out of money. Its all about self-esteem. Someone who habitually goes needs some serious ego inflation and isnt willing to actually earn peoples respect so he buys it from an attractive woman who doesnt judge him. Ive worked the grave-yard shift next to strip club for more than a year and half, my conveniance store is a bit of a break room for the girls. Something thats not rare is for a guy to pay for private dance and just sit there and talk to the girl, sometimes even crying on the girls shoulder kinda like a topless therapist.
Its not all dirty old perverts and guys compensating with money, some people are just lonely. Think Inara from Firefly.
Posts: 2302 | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
While I consider the customers at strip clubs somewhat pathetic, I don't blame the strippers. I'm sure there are plenty of strippers who are not whores. We have a rent-a midget company in my city. You can rent a midget to attend your party. Is this insensitive? There are probably more full sized people complaining than the little guy who appreciates the pay check. Mental midgets with a nice rack need to make money too. (I doubt the "I'm paying my way through law school" argument is really all that accurate with strippers) Good money, good chance of catching a meal ticket. I've never seen an attractive homeless woman.
Posts: 1495 | Registered: Mar 2009
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posted
Homelessness kind of interferes with the beauty regimen, I think. Anyway, there's nothing about stripping that demands a low IQ, you know.
Posts: 4287 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
You're correct. You could be a smart stripper...I would like to see those IQ results. I've seen homeless men who look better than my Project Manager who is married to a woman twenty years younger. If we are going to demonize any group in society for having won the genetic lottery...skin color is second to sex and attractiveness. The fat stupid man can't resort to taking off his clothes or marrying a wealthy woman.
Posts: 1495 | Registered: Mar 2009
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posted
Dude, I know 3 girls who got their Master's Degrees doing it, and one who got her PHD in Psychology no less.
I doubt you could READ her IQ test results.
Guys, here is a perfect example of the saying " You can't fix stupid".
Most of the ones I knew...and I knew a lot of them, just not from the club, but because they worked with my friends...were not stupid. Most of them weren't really smart, either, I'll grant you that. But they all made between $50,000 to $120,000 a year, depending on how much they worked and what clubs they worked. Even people with a PHD don't always make that much. They also, on average, payed taxes on less than 1/3 of that income, making their disposable income even higher than someone earning that kind of money at a regular job.
Most are NOT hookers, and don't sleep with their customers. Probably 80%, if not more, come from broken homes with little formal education, and a lot of them are single mothers who get little to no support from the father of the kid. I'd say most of them use it to have a good time, raise their kids, and then move on in 3-4 years to other jobs.
You might be surprised at some of the women who did this when they were younger. Might just be a soccer mom next to you in the stands, or the secretary at the local law office.
The flip side is that you can't do it forever, your income is variable, and you have to deal with people who have attitudes like Mal's day in and day out. Most of whom want you screw them, but who fail to even consider you are a human being.
They earn their money, that's for sure. It may not be brain surgery, but then most of our jobs aren't either. It's a hard life for most of them, and while I don't want to participate in that lifestyle myself, I sure don't envy them their lives.
posted
I was acquainted with a stripper, once. She was using the money to put herself through college. Since I was introduced to her in a college dorm, I was inclined to believe the story.
Anchorage, Alaska, has way too many strip clubs. I've been to a few, though it was more than a decade ago, now. There's at least one in Anchorage that doesn't serve alcohol so they can bring in the eighteen-up crowd.
I was somewhat nonplussed to hear about how the business arrangement between the club and the stripper works, or at least how it did where I went; the strippers were essentially renting the stages where they danced as a workspace. (And possibly giving the club owners a percentage, in some cases). This seemed to me rather like a movie theater expecting the studios to pay them for the privelige of having them show their movies. If there were no strippers, you wouldn't be able to sell overpriced drinks, guys. How does this work? (Actually, I guess that applies to the movie theaters as well, come to think of it...)
I enjoy looking at attractive women as much as the next guy, but I have to agree that there's something really plastic about the whole experience, and the more you know about it, the more unreal it seems. And from what I've read from some strippers' accounts, it becomes pretty easy to start thinking of people as potential sources of money rather than people. The dehumanizing process can go both ways.
The only time I can say I've ever exactly "enjoyed" a strip club was when two female friends came along and kind of joked and flirted with the strippers. That was sort of fun and sexy. The rest of the time... The experience was deadening, if not uncomfortable.
My bachelor's party took place largely at Wizards of the Coast and an Irish bar. Like I say, I haven't been in one in more than ten years, and I don't feel like I'm missing out.
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
It's true that for the majority of clubs, the stripper pays to work there. The numbers vary for the low-to-upscale but it's along the lines of: pay $30 to work the shift required set of stage work x times your shift minimum bar purchases by customers say, $4 of every $20 lap dance tip the bouncers every shift tip the DJ every shift tip the bar every shift
Posts: 1261 | Registered: Apr 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Raymond Arnold: Wizards of the Coast... as in, the game company? Did/do you work there?
In days of yore... Which is to say, about a decade ago... WotC not only was a game company, but had a number of stores that sold games. Many of these same had back rooms for people to gather and play various games; the crown jewel of this little enterprise in Seattle's University District also had a restaurant, a video game arcade, and a large network of rentable computers.
...And then Hasbro, in its finite wisdom, decided that it wasn't generating enough cash and closed them all down. Alas.
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Strip clubs are a place you go to once and then never again. Its entertaining for the first few minutes you're there but then when you start looking around at how the other guys there are behaving you kinda ask yourself the question if you're really as misogynistic as they are and then you get up and leave. I couldn't imagine going there for work.
Posts: 1158 | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote: I don't object to strip clubs, and have no issue with anyone who wants to go to one, but it is a waste to me. A waste of time, of money, and even of desire.
posted
It seems to me that those of you who complain about the artifice might wish to remember the phrase "willing suspension of disbelief". There are many experiences that are not enjoyable if you focus too strongly on their artificiality; but nobody uses that as an excuse for opinions which just happen to coincide with the socially acceptable ones in the case of movies and books.
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by dabbler: It's true that for the majority of clubs, the stripper pays to work there. The numbers vary for the low-to-upscale but it's along the lines of: pay $30 to work the shift required set of stage work x times your shift minimum bar purchases by customers say, $4 of every $20 lap dance tip the bouncers every shift tip the DJ every shift tip the bar every shift
This is the most common set up I have heard of, although most places have a minimum tip out for the DJ, as a lot of dancers try to skate without tipping them out at times.
My friend who DJ's often made between $300 - $500 on a weekend night, including his $45 shift pay and tip outs, but those clubs usually have 20-40 girls working., and I think the minimum tip out was either $15 or $25, depending on if it was a double shift or not.
A LOT of the girls did tip out better than that, as a DJ could wreck their night if they were too rude. Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Sterling: Anchorage, Alaska, has way too many strip clubs.
Of which I've been to only two, but I'll just come right out and say that I actually enjoy them. I don't find them awkward at all.
A lot of people complain about the falseness of it, but that never bothered me. Of course it's fiction. So is the movie you just went and saw. No, this stripper doesn't really find you attractive. But that guy on the screen didn't really just kill that other guy, either.
As with any form of entertainment, a great deal depends on what expectations you bring to it yourself. Even at my loneliest, I never pretended the strippers were interested in me, or ever had a need or a wish for it. And while it's sad how many guys go to such places thinking they're getting more than they really are, it's really their own fault for not distinguishing reality from fiction.
A strip club, to me, is sort of a combination of theater and art gallery. I'm there to appreciate beauty, and in a social context where it's okay to look continuously. (Nobody complains if you stare at a stripper or a painting, but at a shopping mall or city park, it makes people uneasy.) And there is an element of fictional theater involved when the beautiful girl, in exchange for a fee, gets naked and crawls on top of me and pretends that she thinks I'm cute and have interesting things to say. She knows it's fiction, and I know it's fiction, so no harm is done.
That said, it is obviously a very sexually-charged form of theater (as it is meant to be), so I have stopped going since I'm no longer single. Fiction though it is, I don't think it would be appropriate now. And I don't want to give the impression that it's something I did often, either. I doubt I've been even a dozen times in my life, or not much more than that anyway, and when friends suggested it, it was always something I could take or leave. But when I did go, I didn't turn red and cast my eyes downward, either.
Posts: 1814 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by King of Men: It seems to me that those of you who complain about the artifice might wish to remember the phrase "willing suspension of disbelief". There are many experiences that are not enjoyable if you focus too strongly on their artificiality; but nobody uses that as an excuse for opinions which just happen to coincide with the socially acceptable ones in the case of movies and books.
I think it's the uncanny valley effect. TV, books, movies, and pornography require total suspension of disbelief to have much effect.
It's hard to express... but imagine a lonely man watching a movie about a perfect family celebrating Christmas to help alleviate that loneliness. Now imagine him hiring a group of people to pretend to be his family on Christmas morning, so he can simulate that feeling for a day.
Posts: 2222 | Registered: Dec 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Dogbreath: imagine a lonely man watching a movie about a perfect family celebrating Christmas to help alleviate that loneliness. Now imagine him hiring a group of people to pretend to be his family on Christmas morning, so he can simulate that feeling for a day.
quote:Originally posted by Dogbreath: It's hard to express... but imagine a lonely man watching a movie about a perfect family celebrating Christmas to help alleviate that loneliness. Now imagine him hiring a group of people to pretend to be his family on Christmas morning, so he can simulate that feeling for a day.
Are you implying this would be a bad thing? I kinda like the idea.
Posts: 884 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
I suppose it's always going to raise some questions when one gets something (or a fantasy of that thing) for money when the "normal transaction" for said thing involves time, attention, and affection. For some, both inside and outside the process, it might lead one to inquire as to what the purchaser is lacking that leads them to go take the "short cut". I'm not saying this in judgement of the act, only to suggest that there may be qualms that go beyond cultural puritanism.
Posts: 3826 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
See, the first few times I did go to one, I DID turn a little bit red, and stayed away from the stage until I felt more comfortable.
Unfortunately, this got me MORE attention from the girls. They all thought it was funny, and tried to make me blush MORE.
Of course, it didn't help that I ran into an ex the first time I went to one, either. She wasn't doing THAT when we dated...hell, I hesitate even calling her an ex, as we went out maybe 10 times total.
But still, it was a little surreal....
Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Shmuel: Are you implying this would be a bad thing? I kinda like the idea.
I didn't say anything about good or bad, it's just something that would make most people uncomfortable. (I know I'd be freaked out by hired family members doing fake family moments) I was trying to explain to KoM why so many people here find strippers at least mildly disturbing. If you like it, more power to you. It doesn't mean you're bad, just that you're able to enjoy something that others can't.
steven: Strangely enough, this isn't the first time I've had a random disturbing idea that I later find out is common practice in Japan.
Posts: 2222 | Registered: Dec 2008
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posted
As a slight aside from the hired family bit, one can also make other comparisons between television/live suspension of disbelief for enjoyment.
- Watching Braveheart vs. participating in the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism) - Watching Glory vs. participating in Civil War reenactment - Playing Modern Warfare 2 vs. playing paintball - Playing a first person shooter video game vs. going to a firing range - Watching Apollo 13 vs. going to Space Camp
It's fairly common for people to pay money or go to extra effort to have a live simulation of something rather than watching it on television or reading about it. The big difference with strip clubs is that they involve nudity and simulated sexual attraction/contact, which run against the fairly Puritanical grain of many people.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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Someone in the comments there linked [url= http://"http://www.creatingextendedfamilies.com"]this[/url] place. Rather than renting out fake families, the site matches you up with other people in your area who are in similar need of companionship. (If you need a mother figure it matches someone who wants a child). You pay a one time fee for the service and then make whatever relationship you want out of it.
I'm not sure how well it works but it sounds neat.
Posts: 4136 | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
My point is that it's not an uncommon human behavior to pay money to participate in a live simulation. Strip clubs simply carry more moral stigma - the motivation to pay money for fantasy fulfillment in a general sense is not uncommon at all.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
And there ARE stigma's attacked to each of those as well, despite those activities having no sexual connotations.
The stigma's aren;t as widespread....but no one playing MW2 THINKS it is really war, or a firing range.
Quite a few of the guys in strip clubs honestly think, no matter how mistaken, that being there gives them a chance at getting a girl IRL. Many of them have trouble distinguishing between their fantasy of the "perfect" girl and the reality of a RL relationship.
I am not saying you are wrong, simply saying that there are plenty of people who aren't puritanical about their sex lives who still feel discomfort with strip clubs , or renting a family to pretend you aren't alone for the holidays.
There IS a difference between RL and fantasy, and some situations blur the line a little bit too much for comfort.
Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:There IS a difference between RL and fantasy, and some situations blur the line a little bit too much for comfort.
True, but the same can be said for LARPing. I mean, there are people who have problems with the distinction between RL/Fantasy even with television programs. I think that blurring depends on the individual more than the situation.
And yes, there are stigmas attached to many of those examples above. But the stigma of being viewed as a "geek" or "dork" for participating in the SCA (or LARP) pales in comparison to the stigma of being viewed as a "deviant" or "pervert" for participating at a strip club.
Posts: 3960 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
I don't know about that. Being labeled a geek used to be a fairly strong stigma, at least when I was a young adult.
Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
It hasn't been for quite some time. People have gradually caught on that we're running the world now. Also, the way and reasons that people make fun of people in high school have changed somewhat. So long as you are confident and have generally good interpersonal skills you'll do just fine, and if you are made fun of it won't be for being a geek so much as a loser.
Posts: 4136 | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
I have to admit to some bewilderment here. I always assumed that going to a strip club was a rather straightforward money-for-boobs transaction. I never really imagined there was a fantasy-roleplay vibe expected. I mean, paying to see naked bodies twist in interesting ways, well, that's not my ideal use of money but to each his own. The fantasy aspect is what I find kind of weird.
But then, I've never been to a club, so I really don't know.
Posts: 2849 | Registered: Feb 2002
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posted
I really don't think mainstream America views geeks in quite the same light as they did in the bad old days, with two-dimensional portrayals in John Hughes movies and so on. We may not be quite the norm, but we aren't as mysterious and "other" as we used to be. These days, everybody knows and is friends with geeks. Heck, I think the large and growing numbers of female geeks in my generation and later is a sure sign of something.
I don't know that there's really a social stigma to going to strip clubs, either, in the sense of people who do it having to hide the fact or risk becoming outcasts. Perhaps in heavily religious communities that may be the case, but strip clubs aren't exactly clandestine these days.
Here in Anchorage there's a strip club downtown that stood right next door to a family restaurant for a long time. I don't know which was put in first, but I never heard anyone complain about it. (The family restaurant isn't there anymore. There's a porn shop there now.)
Of course, farther down the same street, there's a preschool right next door to a tobacco and knife shop. That's not "a tobacco shop and a knife shop", by the way. It's the same shop. Next door to the preschool. So yeah. Maybe it's just us.
Posts: 1814 | Registered: Jul 2004
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posted
Alaskan's aren't any different. They have the same things as every city, just condensed into a smaller area. No one wants an elementary school sandwiched in between a bar and a strip club but every city needs a bar, elementary school and a strip club. Hold your nose up because the bar you attend is a mile away from the elementary school and the one in Alaska is next door. Every town needs: school, bar, post office, strip club. The size and segregation of the town does not change the nature of man. A small town is no worse for having these things due to proximity. The wealthy suburbanite who sends his kid to a secluded school while visiting the strip-club on the other side of town shouldn't hold up his nose.
Posts: 1495 | Registered: Mar 2009
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posted
My high school in Anchorage was (and still is, to the best of my knowledge) sandwiched between a dry cleaner that had been cited by the EPA and a couple of "escort services"- and those scare quotes are as long as your arm.
Yeah. Anchorage. Zoning... Interesting.
It's not a "condensed into a smaller area" thing, though. Anchorage is the biggest city in Alaska, with a population in the neighborhood of 300,000. And it has a population density of about 164 people per square mile. By comparison, Seattle has over 7,000 people per square mile.
Frankly, I think many Alaskans have always had a bit of a "I'm going to do this, here, and put this, here- ANYONE GOT A PROBLEM WITH THAT?" mentality. Comes with the whole "last frontier" thing.
posted
I've never been to one, but here's what I'm wondering:
In this day and age of easily accessible and free pornography, why are strip clubs still necessary?
On the other hand, if the routines strippers perform are any where near as hot as that which Rebecca Ramos does in Brian De Palma's "Femme Fatale" (available on youtube) then I can see why people go to them.
Posts: 532 | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Clive Candy: I've never been to one, but here's what I'm wondering:
In this day and age of easily accessible and free pornography, why are strip clubs still necessary?
On the other hand, if the routines strippers perform are any where near as hot as that which Rebecca Ramos does in Brian De Palma's "Femme Fatale" (available on youtube) then I can see why people go to them.
To your first point--because people don't actually know all the different kinds of porn that are easily found via search engines. LOL
To you second point--yes, some strippers in the better-quality clubs really are gorgeous, both with and without clothes. I haven't been to a lot of clubs, probably only 4 ever, but I've been to a couple of the nicer ones, as well as one of the nasty ones.
Posts: 3354 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Sterling: Frankly, I think many Alaskans have always had a bit of a "I'm going to do this, here, and put this, here- ANYONE GOT A PROBLEM WITH THAT?" mentality. Comes with the whole "last frontier" thing.
It's true. For all our internet connections and iPhones and DVR boxes, we are still on the frontier. You have to be fairly tough to live here, and we put a premium on individuality. I really don't know if having a family restaurant next door to a strip club would fly anywhere else in the country, but I never heard even conservatives complain about it.
Of course, we all joked about it. ("Sit tight, kids, daddy's gonna go to the bathroom . . . for about forty minutes.") And I don't claim that nobody ever complained. It's just that in all those years, I didn't hear any complaints.
quote:Originally posted by Clive Candy: In this day and age of easily accessible and free pornography, why are strip clubs still necessary?
To the extent that they were ever "necessary", I would say they still are simply because a real, live, genuinely present woman is always better than a digitized image. One may as well ask why recreational (as opposed to procreative) sex is still "necessary" in an age of free porn. Different guys with their own special kinks might arrange the following slightly differently, but I'd venture to say that for most guys, the hierarchy goes like this:
Real sex with a woman > Watching live strippers > Looking at websites > Looking at magazines > Looking at drawings > Having no visual aides at all.
Individual mileage may vary, as I said, but there are not many guys that would actually prefer to look at an image of a naked woman when they have the option of being in the presence of an actual naked woman.
Posts: 1814 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Clive Candy: I've never been to one, but here's what I'm wondering:
In this day and age of easily accessible and free pornography, why are strip clubs still necessary?
Several points here: First, strip-club clientele is more working-class than middle-class; the Internet does not yet have 100% penetration in that income level. Second is Verily's hierarchy. Third, I think it's entirely possible that strip clubs are headed for a major downturn; for all we know they've been losing market share for a decade. Presumably someone keeps statistics on the adult industry, but I think it might be difficult to find any analysis of it.
Posts: 10645 | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Sterling: My high school in Anchorage was (and still is, to the best of my knowledge) sandwiched between a dry cleaner that had been cited by the EPA and a couple of "escort services"- and those scare quotes are as long as your arm.
Yeah. Anchorage. Zoning... Interesting.
It's not a "condensed into a smaller area" thing, though. Anchorage is the biggest city in Alaska, with a population in the neighborhood of 300,000. And it has a population density of about 164 people per square mile. By comparison, Seattle has over 7,000 people per square mile.
Frankly, I think many Alaskans have always had a bit of a "I'm going to do this, here, and put this, here- ANYONE GOT A PROBLEM WITH THAT?" mentality. Comes with the whole "last frontier" thing.
I like that attitude..it's the attitude of freedom. That's the same reason I refuse to live in an association neighborhood. My brother lives in an association neighborhood where he pays dues and pickup trucks are banned from driveways and color schemes are dictated. While I do not like my Puerto Rican neighbor's lime green house, I like the fact that he can paint his house that color in my neighborhood. It's his house do with as he pleases.
Posts: 1495 | Registered: Mar 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Clive Candy: I've never been to one, but here's what I'm wondering:
In this day and age of easily accessible and free pornography, why are strip clubs still necessary?
If you'd been to one, you wouldn't need to ask this.
I'm pretty much with Verily; comparing an actual woman with a photograph or movie is... well, you might as well ask why live theatre and concerts are necessary. Or live therapists, in this day and age of easily accessible self-help books and websites.
Posts: 884 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Without strip clubs how would I get my fix of ridiculous naming schemes like 'XTC', or suggestive slogans like 'Our girls wear nothing but a smile'?
Interesting tidbit on zoning: my Aunt used to work for 'the' city (no names please ) and when tracing out various options for how to lay out the different zoning areas their tool and test was SimCity! I always thought that was pretty neat.
posted
I have been to a few strip clubs because my friends find them fun and they like to take their girlfriends to topless bars for their birthdays.
Men are usually tempted to ogle. Some of those girls are -super- hot. Put two and two together and....
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If we are going to demonize any group in society for having won the genetic lottery...skin color is second to sex and attractiveness. The fat stupid man can't resort to taking off his clothes or marrying a wealthy woman.
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