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» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Books, Films, Food and Culture » The biggest Pinocchios of 2013

   
Author Topic: The biggest Pinocchios of 2013
Stephan
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Link

One of the most unbiased articles of this type that I have seen in a while. Both parties are nailed to the wall. Republicans are jumping on the fact that Obama is listed three times. And, in my moderate opinion, the biggest was about being able to keep your healthcare. But there are some great ones on there that I still have friends and family swearing is the truth.

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Samprimary
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that's a really extremely weird list, especially for WaPo. The NRA one doesn't even really register. If an example of one of their top "pinnochios" is that the NRA was saying that obama's kids are protected by armed guards at their school but it wasn't the school guards protecting obama's kids who were armed but it was the secret service armed guards who were protecting obama's kids at their school, then their list of the biggest lies doesn't even scratch the surface of the actual biggest lies told this year.
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Darth_Mauve
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Most common lie of the year--so maybe considered the biggest: "You'll be sorry for breaking up with me."

Told by every person who ever had someone break up with them.

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Aros
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Just as big of a lie . . . "I'm just not ready for a relationship". Well, it's more of a half-truth. You just have to add the words "with you" to the end.
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Geraine
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quote:
Originally posted by Aros:
Just as big of a lie . . . "I'm just not ready for a relationship". Well, it's more of a half-truth. You just have to add the words "with you" to the end.

What about "It's not you, it's me."
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Samprimary
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After overtalking and overthinking this i think that the problem with a real 'the biggest [american politics] lies of 2013' list is that the obamacare/shutdown crisis will simply dominate it. period.

hell, even obama's grand mal whopper gets easily pushed down by a healthy substrata of things routinely said by tea party republicans in the house about either obamacare itself or the government shutdown/furlough. you have to introduce SO MANY caveats to keep it from going monotoned. You have to specifically also limit representatives and/or just give some specific people their own article, and you also have to completely omit state-level representatives too.

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Lyrhawn
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I think because the Tea Party has managed to acculturate the news media to frequent and reflexively lying that they've honestly become inured to it.

It's not a red flag because it happens every day. They manage to keep moving the bar because we keep tolerating their crazy.

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Samprimary
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there's ten 2013 statements from glenn beck alone which are more egregious lies than their #1 'Pinocchio'
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Samprimary
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i really want to go back to the republican presidential primary years of politifact though because that was just so weird and twisted and different. remember when herman cain was warning us that china was trying to develop nuclear capabilities??? oh no!!!!!!!
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FoolishTook
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Interesting link. I'm curious what are actual lies and what are misunderstandings. I think Obama's janitor "lie" might have been a misunderstanding of how those pay cuts worked. The other "lies" also seemed to come from people who got bad information (and there's a lot of it out there) and repeated that information.

I think the biggest lie was the ACA "You can keep your healthcare." But that also could have been a misunderstanding of how ACA would manifest itself, how the consequences of forcing insurance companies to meet certain government standards would affect the average person. It shows a lack of insight, and a cavalier attitude towards the power they wield, but it may not have been a lie.

The reality is that if your opponent said it, it was clearly a bald-faced lie.

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Kwea
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Not as it was said, because it was pertaining to "Obama will take away our healthcare"....and he didn't. Greedy companies took any excuse, real or not, to jack up prices. It wasn't accurate, but it was an over-generalization.
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Samprimary
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There were a certain subset of really extremely terrible health care plans which were a total ripoff and that you really didn't want, and the aca had some regulations in it which forced insurers not to offer these ridiculously terrible plans, so if you liked your really awful totally exploitative bargain-basement plan you COULDN'T keep it, so the statement was a falsehood.

"If you like your health-care plan, you can keep it" was just not an accurate statement. Still, lol at the idea it was the biggest lie of the year.

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Vadon
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quote:
Originally posted by Samprimary:
There were a certain subset of really extremely terrible health care plans which were a total ripoff and that you really didn't want, and the aca had some regulations in it which forced insurers not to offer these ridiculously terrible plans, so if you liked your really awful totally exploitative bargain-basement plan you COULDN'T keep it, so the statement was a falsehood.

"If you like your health-care plan, you can keep it" was just not an accurate statement. Still, lol at the idea it was the biggest lie of the year.

I thought that those horrible-no-good-expensive-ripoff plans were grandfathered in for a year or so unless they made any change to the plan. Insurance companies decided to say, "Screw it. We don't want to be forced to keep these plans as they exist, so we'll just end them now rather than grandfathering them."

Either way, one year down the road or now, the ACA's regulations on what plans must cover would come into conflict with those junk plans. So yeah, some people are going to lose those plans.

I could go on message with some defenses of the statement--that they shouldn't really like those plans, or that the plans they can get will be better.

Buuuuut, no. Whatever cover there might be on the statement, the interpretation was pretty clear and people lost plans they liked. Couple that with the supreme screw-up in the rollout of the website where people could get a plan they would like better, and I can see why people would label this the number one lie of the year.

[ December 20, 2013, 08:46 PM: Message edited by: Vadon ]

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capaxinfiniti
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quote:
Originally posted by Samprimary:
There were a certain subset of really extremely terrible health care plans which were a total ripoff and that you really didn't want, and the aca had some regulations in it which forced insurers not to offer these ridiculously terrible plans, so if you liked your really awful totally exploitative bargain-basement plan you COULDN'T keep it, so the statement was a falsehood.

"If you like your health-care plan, you can keep it" was just not an accurate statement. Still, lol at the idea it was the biggest lie of the year.

The wool must be well over your eyes if you think his comments only amounted to just being "not an accurate statement."

If an advertisement to your restaurant says "Free large fry and coke with every purchase" and I go to your restaurant only to find that not only have you reneged on your offer, you never intended to make good on that offer in the first place, you can't claim your advertisement was anything but a bald-faced lie. Your intentions are evident. You can go on and on about how fries and coke aren't healthy anyway and you're looking out for my best interests and helping me save money, but you can't deny the fact that it was deception that got me to the store in the first place.

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Samprimary
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literal lol, capax

i want to believe you are at least intelligent enough to be able to note that calling something 'a falsehood' and 'not an accurate statement' (both true statements wow) is not contradictory or exclusive against the potential analysis of the statement being a lie. It in fact doesn't comment one way or another about that! the wool must be really over my eyes huh!

i know you keep grasping for opportunities to rail on me because I drive you compleeeeetely craaaaaazy but you're best served waiting for me to say something which isn't in all senses completely fairly stated and accurate

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capaxinfiniti
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quote:
Originally posted by Samprimary:
literal lol, capax

i want to believe you are at least intelligent enough to be able to note that calling something 'a falsehood' and 'not an accurate statement' (both true statements wow) is not contradictory or exclusive against the potential analysis of the statement being a lie. It in fact doesn't comment one way or another about that! the wool must be really over my eyes huh!

i know you keep grasping for opportunities to rail on me because I drive you compleeeeetely craaaaaazy but you're best served waiting for me to say something which isn't in all senses completely fairly stated and accurate

If you agree with my comment, that's all that matters. We don't need your ego trip.
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Samprimary
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here on earth that is not called "agreeing" it is called "correcting you" because you are "wrong" and you made an assumption which was "incorrect"

i, like, is .. can anyone possibly explain to him what's going on here, does anyone speak capax

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capaxinfiniti
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It's still unclear to me what you're saying. You write like a 14 year old so at times it's hard to follow.

Ok. So I made an assumption about your position which was incorrect. "Inaccurate" and "falsehood" don't have the same meaning as "lie" and from my perspective, seemed to be minimizing the size and seriousness of Obama's deception. What, then, are you actually trying to say?

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Samprimary
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I'm serious is there anyone else here who wants to take a crack at getting this guy to comprehend what's going on

lyrhawn? anybody? please?? HELP ME, HE'S IMPOSSIBLE

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Lyrhawn
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Sorry, I made a New Year's Resolution last year to only have unproductive conversations on Facebook walls.

My New Year's Resolution this year is to not have any discussions on Facebook walls.

I'm weaning myself off slowly.

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Samprimary
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This isn't facebook though! I haven't seen a single advertisement for Zoosk.
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