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Author Topic: In cas yeou need a good laugh...
Christine
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Someone posted this one another writing site (Codex) and I just had to share it with you guys.

http://www.girlondemand.blogspot.com/2006/06/random-notes-to-authors-of-last-seven.html


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Elan
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VERY amusing. I second the comment about gynecological exams.
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authorsjourney
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I love POD-dy Mouth, not only for all the wonderful selections, but also for the fantastic titles some of these books have, like "Isn't That Bigamy?"
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Inkwell
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Er...no comment, on exams of any kind.

That criteek was humerus.


Inkwell
-----------------
"The difference between a writer and someone who says they want to write is merely the width of a postage stamp."
-Anonymous


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Leigh
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I probably sound really ignorant for saying this, but... I have no idea what POD is and I tried to understand it and all, but ultimately failed.
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authorsjourney
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POD = print on demand. This means that the POD publisher does not do the normal large print runs that traditional publishers do. Instead, they "print on demand", making new books as they sell them. A few reputable small publishers are beginning to use this business model because it reduces up-front print costs before the sales start rolling in.

However, the vast majority of POD "publishers" are vanity press. First, you write and edit your book. Then you pay them hundreds or thousands of dollars to print copies of your book. Then it's pretty much up to you to market and sell your book. These "publishers" will accept any work, regardless of quality, and usually do no editing whatsoever. They make their money primarily from the fees they charge writers, not from book sales (though they do take a sizable portion of the sale profits too).

The upshoot of all this is that most books published POD these days are by authors who have not polished their work enough to get it published traditionally. Instead, they pay a large sum to have it printed by a POD company. Most of these books are...iffy, at best. Because there is no editorial constraint on quality and no marketing for these books, they generally don't sell, and the author will see little return on the investment.


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Thieftess
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Okay...I have to throw in on this one, just out of principle.

I used to work as a freelance copyeditor for BookSurge, and I thought the "Random Notes" was hilarious. I could tell you sentences written by actual human beings that would make your ears curl.

Most of what authorsjourney says is correct -- those vanity presses (where the author PAYS to be published) are normally very low quality, have little to no editing, and sell to only the author's friends and family.

However, there are MANY publishers using POD technology nowadays, since they have low print costs and need to keep ZERO inventory on hand. Plus, the technology is SO good, you would never know that your copy of DaVinci Code was printed by an offset printer, or by Lightning Source. My company, Nyx Books, has a Graphic Novel (Fragrance of You) printed by Lulu.com (only because Lightning Source didn't have the 4-color printing available in the format we wanted). Just looking at Fragrance, you wouldn't know that it wasn't published by Vertigo.

Many large publishers are adopting POD technology, so that they don't ever have to status a book Out of Print.

I would amend authorsjourney's comment about "most books published POD nowadays" to say: most BOOKS published POD nowadays are by well-established and academic publishers, and you would never know they are POD. Most PUBLISHERS...well, the small presses with taste and standards will always have to fight against the glut of vanity presses out there giving a bad name to their business.

We only hope our quality speaks for itself.

~Alethea


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authorsjourney
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quote:
I would amend authorsjourney's comment about "most books published POD nowadays" to say: most BOOKS published POD nowadays are by well-established and academic publishers, and you would never know they are POD.

Sorry if I was unclear. There are definitely good and worthwhile books published under the POD model. However, I think most of the books that POD-dy Mouth reviews are of the vanity press variety.

quote:
Most PUBLISHERS...well, the small presses with taste and standards will always have to fight against the glut of vanity presses out there giving a bad name to their business.

I feel that most of the responsibility for this problem lies with the authors. Yes, the vanity publishers try to make you think you'll sell a million copies, even though 99% of their customers never sell 100. But so much of this market is supported by authors who refuse to believe their work is not yet good enough to be published, and don't do the proper fact checking before plopping down their $1000.


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Thieftess
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I agree with you 100%.

I can't tell you how many authors I've met who don't have the self-confidence to beat their head against the brick wall that is the Real Publishing Industry...and then turn into POD people who get themselves booked on panels at conventions so they can spout the gospel of Self-Publishing to the masses.

It's a downright shame.

Though I do have to admit that one of my favorite pasttimes is sitting in the audience at one of these panels, so that when the POD person inevitably says: "There is really no difference between self publishing and publishing through one of the Big Six," I can shout: "Yeah, except for the TEN THOUSAND DOLLAR ADVANCE!!"


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Christine
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Self-publishing is worse than whether or not there is an advance. Even going with a small publisher who can't afford a big advance, if at all, has more clout than going through self-publishing. If you have published your own book than no one but YOU thinks it's good enough to be published -- at least no one reliable. I absolutely refuse to buy a book that is self-published unless we're talkiing about some kind of niche market (like my mom's family cookbook).

Publishers do more than market your book. Selling/marketing is something you have to do on your own to a great extent even if you have a big publishing house behind you to help. (I'm sure Alethea can talk about this a bit -- I noticed many book signings on her web site.) But the real thing that publishers do is put their stamp of approval on the book. They tell bookstores (who are considering shelving your book) and media (who consider writing a review) that there is some legitimacy here and that it's worth their time, effort, and even money to take seriously.

They also tell ME that. I won't buy a self-published book, not even from a friend of acquaintance (unless, like I said, it' smy mom's family cookbook). It's not even price -- it's that stamp of approval.

If you can't get the stamp, I say get back to the keyboard or notebook and get writing!


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Thieftess
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Actually, all the signings and appearances I have done so far (and still have yet to do) I have set up myself. I'm still way too new a name to have a fancy tour sponsored by a publisher. But the publicists at both Tor and Candlewick have been very supportive, and have asked me to forward them all the contact information and update them on where I'll be.

There is definitely something to be said for that highly sought-after legitimacy...people will approach you differently--and are more willing to work with you--if they know you're with a "real" publisher. Plus, it's a nice bonus to be able to tell the libraries and bookstores that they can contact my publicist if they have any questions.

(Of course....the last time someone actually DID contact the publicist, she directed them to my "very comprehensive" website. Which was both complimentary and hilarious at the same time. )

~Alethea


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pooka
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The meaning of POD seemed to be adequately explained by the header of the page. But I probably wouldn't know if I hadn't gone through NaNoWriMo. The community is very good at educating authors about the various scams (well, Beth is at least). I'm glad POD is available for things like that Mormons with Autism book. I could see me buying some Firefly fanfic in POD... Wasn't that lady with the Star Wars fanfic a POD?
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Leigh
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Print on demand, self-publishing... Never wanted to go down that road anyway. Well, thank you everyone for clearing that up for me So I now know to stay away from self-publishing books, which it is a good idea if you're desperate to get published, but if you want it to be of high quality you have to wait. I'd rather wait
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Survivor
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You can't publish fan-fic for sale, even if it's through POD. If any money accrues to you or the publisher, it's way over that fine line that divides fun and games from legally actionable violations.

Anyway, I agree with Poddy Mouth, whoever she is. About POV in general, anyway. I also find her judgement to be understandable, if not infallible.


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TruHero
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Ass-gauge still has me laughing! Were there some important comments made after that?
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Louiseoneal
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I was kinda surprised to read this, though:

"So I did a little research. It turns out many decent books that were once POD went on to do well and sell to major publishers, including LEGALLY BLONDE by Amanda Brown and THE IDIOT GIRLS’ ACTION ADVERNTURE CLUB by Laurie Notaro (which I read when it was a NY Times bestseller and had no idea it was once POD.)"

I'd still rather try to figure out why something got rejected, rewrite, and send it back out to a regular publisher, though.


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Elan
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I hate to be the dissenting voice. (... actually, that's not true. I rather like it when I am.) But being a self-publisher using POD services does NOT preclude you from being published by a normal publisher.

The books “What Color is Your Parachute,” “Chicken Soup for the Soul,” and “The Celestine Prophecy” all started out as self-published titles that migrated over to big publishers once they demonstrated successful sales.

Publisher's Weekly, THE International Voice For Book Publishing and Bookselling, has printed articles that talk about the change in the publishing industry brought on by legitimate POD publishers.

The reality is that the publishing industry is in the middle of big changes, and they know that if they don't adapt, they'll die as an industry. Some publishers are getting into POD publishing themselves. Xlibris, part of Random House, and iUniverse, backed by Barnes and Noble, are two well-known and reputable on-demand service providers. The publishing industry is well aware of the fact that there are billions of dollars of revenue going, each year, to small independent publishers who are using POD services to keep inventory tight, turn around fast, and maintain an expansive catalog of titles that never have to go "out of print."

The trick is to make sure you aren't working with a POD publisher who is a scam artist *cough*PublishAmerica*cough*. My advice is to research any POD publisher thoroughly, and Preditors and Editors is a reputable watchdog that keeps a good list of legit publishers, as well as a list of the scam artists. (Here I might noticed that PublishAmerica earned their own full page on the "scam" list.)

Print On Demand is no longer an automatic kiss of death. Many people are now finding that if you can show lively sales for your POD book, you WILL get noticed by the big publishing houses.


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goatboy
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Thanks, Christine! I needed that.
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Thieftess
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"Many people are now finding that if you can show lively sales for your POD book, you WILL get noticed by the big publishing houses."

Seriously, though...do yourself a favor and don't be one of these people.

There will always be the "one in a million" guy, and everyone likes to think they too can win that lottery. If that's the direction you want to take your career, bless your heart and I wish the best for you.

Just promise me you won't go selling yourself short right off the bat, okay?


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