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Author Topic: At what point is a Novelette a Novel?
MommaMuse
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Where is the cutoff line between novelettes and novels? Is it a page number, or the number of chapters? What is the difference between short stories and novelettes?

It's not really a big deal right now, I just would like to know!


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AeroB1033
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I believe it goes something like this:

-Up to 7,500 words: Short Story
-7,500-17,500 words: Novelette
-17,500-40,000 words: Novella

Anything beyond that I suppose would qualify as a novel, but I don't think very many novels get published that are under fifty or sixty thousand words.


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Rahl22
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Everyone has their own system, but word count (like what Aero posted) is what I see most often.

And 40,000 is a very marketable length -- if you're writing YA.


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J
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Write 39,999 words.

Add "The End"

Insist that 40,001 words makes a novel.


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Robert Nowall
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Marketing. I've seen some really short stuff palmed off as "novels," apparently just because it's one single story between the covers.

But most stick to the actual word length definitions. Aero B1033 (sounds like a radio station call sign, doesn't it?) has it down pretty much, but I'd probably put it at:

Short story: 7500 words and under.

Novelette: 7500 to 20000 words.

Novella: 20000 to 50000 words.

Novel: 50000 words and up.


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Rahl22
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I believe Aero was just using SFWA's definition, but again, it can vary.
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AeroB1033
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That's true, I forgot about the YA market.
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Robert Nowall
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I may have been a bit hasty. I must have the SFWA definitions somewhere in the clutter of my home, but I didn't remember them offhand.

Way back when I started writing seriously (and paid attention to such things), I remember a number of markets wanting, more or less, short stories under 7500 words, but novelettes over 10000 words. It seemed to leave a void between two definitions.

As to the why of it, I figured it was the way magazines were put together---a jigsaw puzzle of printed columns, as it were. Does anybody still practice it?


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MommaMuse
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Coolness. Spank you all very much! It's definitely more than 7500 words, but until I get Word on this comp, I'm just going to have to wait on a specific word count. I know that it's at 70 pages, and I still have almost a third of the book to write, so....WHEW! I think it'll be somewhere around 100 to 120 pages long.

Now I just have to figure out what genre my book would fall under! LOL. It's definitely not going to be YA! LOL.

Wait, let me qualify...It's not a "adult" story, either. It just has a few racy parts that are unaviodable because they're part of the story. Ok...I feel better....


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Jon Roberts
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I now do almost all of my typing on an antique typewriter and I find that a good way of figuring out a (very) rough word count without the wordcount function of modern word processors is this:

A double-spaced page of mostly prose is about 325 words
A double-spaced page at about 1/3 1/2 dialogue is about 300 words
A double-spaced page of all dialogue is about 200.
A single spaced page gets around 625 words (give or take thirty depending on the dialogue)

When I'm figuring out a large number of pages (twenty or thirty after a marathon session) I just multiply by 300 and round up.

It's not going to let you plan out your 40,001 word novel, but it'll let you know which side of the 7500-10000 word void you're on.

Jon

[This message has been edited by Jon Roberts (edited November 11, 2006).]


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MommaMuse
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Woah! I just got Works to work properly on my comp! YAY! 40,385 words and counting! yessss!
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Jammrock
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Nebula award define it as:

http://www.sfwa.org/awards/rules.htm

Short Story: less than 7,500 words.
Novelette: at least 7,500 words but less than 17,500 words.
Novella: at least 17,500 words but less than 40,000 words.
Novel: 40,000 words or more.

Though SFWA cautions elsewhere (http://www.sfwa.org/writing/faq2.htm):

Q: How do you decide where the novella ends and the novel starts? Does life exist for a story between 16,000 and 60,000 words?

A: SFWA Nebula rules say a short story is 7499 words or fewer, novelette 7500-17,499, novella 17,500-39,999, novel 40,000 or more.

You're much more likely to sell a 20,000 word novella, though the market will always be tighter for them than for shorter works.

In children's books, though, a 30,000 to 40,000 word work can be a whole book by itself.

To sell a novel under 60,000 words to a genre publisher requires a novel that is extraordinary.

Q: So you have a story that is 40,000. Do you pad it to 60, chop it to 20, or leave it be?

A: If you can see a way to chop a 40,000-word story to half that length, or pad it to half again that length, it was either written at the wrong length to start with or it isn't much of a story.

If you can =continue= the story, on the other hand, you may end up with a strong 80,000-word novel in two parts or two books (not physical books, but 2 sections of the novel). Or take that 40,000-word story and carefully analyze it to see whether you might have rushed through a part, or whether there might be a subplot that could be developed with more leisure or detail. Don't pad it, because an editor will spot the treading-water part, and probably yawn and put the thing back in the SASE. But it's possible you missed a place where you could legitimately add 20,000 or so words.

It's not only difficult to sell a novel under 60,000 words, it's difficult for the publisher to push it once it's bought. You wind up with an $18.95 hardcover that's half the physical size of a $20.95 one.

If, however, this story can be told as a YA novel, you've got no problems with its length. YA and middle-grades novels are often 40,000-60,000 words. In fact, middle-grades novels can be shorter.


.....

For hard SciFi and high fantasy though, chances are you won't sell as a new author at less than 80k words. Because, if you think about it, a 500 page novel with 400 words per page is 200k words. Which is about average for hard SciFi and high Fantasy (unless it's a series in which case that's short past book 3).

For mainstream you typically go shorter. Big Fish, for example, sold very well, was turned into a movie, and is 208 pages with *maybe* 300 words per page (208*300=62k). The Stephanie Plum books are usually around 75k words. Stephen King's latest books (beside the Dark Tower) have all been around that size, or slightly larger too.

In the end a lot of it just depends on your market.

[This message has been edited by Jammrock (edited November 28, 2006).]

[This message has been edited by Jammrock (edited November 28, 2006).]


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Christine
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I've never found the 40k mark very useful. Every genre has its own criterion for what makes a MARKETABLE novel and this, IMHO, is far more useful. For example, in mystery/suspense you want 70-90k words. In scifi, you typically want to reach 90-110k. For fantasy, the longer works, 120k +, are becoming very popular although you could probably sell one at 100k. For YA, you are looking for a shorter work to hold a young person's attention.

Capitalism drives everything, in the end.


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Robert Nowall
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Posting to bring this to the front, 'cause somebody brought it up in another thread...
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MommaMuse
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hey! I didn't know that posting brought the thread up on the list! good thing to know, eh? lol
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