Anyway, I've been picking at a world that's been growing in my brain, and it's a standard galaxy-spanning dealie that's available in economy-size at your local Cosco. The plan was space opera with elements of neo-traditional fantasy, but recently, thanks to research I've done for a paper, I've been alerted to the fact that space opera is usually considered a tired and cliche subgenre with many negative connotations.

Now this offends my sensibilities, as 1.) I've grown up on space opera and what I've read has been nothing but good, and 2.) I love space opera, would love to write it, and therefore would be greatly wounded to discover that it's genuinely regarded as tired, cliche, boring, for the birds, etc.

Is the space opera genre overdone? To be honest, I stopped reading it a while ago, seeking more gritty realism in my science fiction than opera typically has (see: Battlestar Galactica). That being said, there is a huge appetite for science fiction out there, and a solidly constructed, well plotted and interestingly populated space opera would likely find a huge audience. I can't really think of a single book-based space opera saga that isn't based either on a movie series or video game franchise. Maybe John Scalzi's Old Man's War and its predecessors - can't say I've read them. So perhaps it's time for a new series to rise up and take Harry Potter's place in the literary pantheon.

Go for it, Jim.

Old Man's War is a standalone, Scalzi's first published novel.

http://www.scalzi.com/books/omwpreview.html

I'd classify Melissa Scott's SF as space opera, because her novels (e.g. Dreaming Metal) are interstellar and have a romantic element. I'd also include Chris Bunch and his Star Risk books.

Here's Wikipedia on Space Opera, classifying as space opera books that are still available in bookstores (still selling well) like OSC's Ender's books, and Catherine Asaro's Skolian Empire series, as well as older standbys like EE Doc Smith, Dune, Foundation and Forever War.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_opera

If current bookstore shelves, TV and film is anything to go by, there's still a strong audience for this genre, overly neglected much to my disappointment--write it!

I apologize for the confusion. I hadn't meant that the ENTIRE genre was cliche, just that most elements featured within (space battles, galactic governments, etc.) were overused. I can agree with those to some extent, such as the unlikelihood of having a galaxy-spanning government, but I stand by my belief that this is an awesome genre. I was just momentarily frightened by what increasingly appears to be a vocal minority.

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Doesn't Old Man's War go along with The Ghost Brigades and The Last Colony?

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Dunno. But "Old Man's War" was his first novel, so I don't see how it can have had predecessors ;-)

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just that most elements featured within (space battles, galactic governments, etc.) were overused

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No more than guns and beautful girls are, er, overused in the spy thriller genre, or nuclear catastrophes, corrupt governments and corporate fraud in dystopian futures.

Indeed, I think some familiar elements are obligatory and readers welcome them because they are familiar--who wants to read space opera without getting excited about interstellar deeps, powerful space ships and jaw-dropping heroes and heroines? When the reader recognizes such elements, and provided they're freshly executed and avoid lazy cliche, he or she settles down in a comfy chair for a "good read".

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I stand by my belief that this is an awesome genre

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Excellent!

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Now if I could only find the #@&!!ing manuscript I seem to have misplaced

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So, not lost in space, but lost in the closet?

Pat

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But "Old Man's War" was his first novel, so I don't see how it can have had predecessors ;-)

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Whoops! Great word choice there, Jay.

I did some looking, and those two books are related to Old Man's War, though only The Last Colony is a sequel. Consider this an advertisement.

LISA: I don't want to move to your space pod. It's too drafty.

DAVE: All right, then I'll get a space heater.

It's just that I doubt if the people of the future will say things that way. It smacks of the "isn't this life in the future wonderful" kind of writing that passed muster in the Gernsback era but doesn't much right now while we actually live in the future of then.

I love space opera. Yeah, there can be cheese, and, like anything, it can be badly done. But it can be brilliantly done as well.

The CUlture, as I mentioned. Stephen Donaldson's GAP series totally changed me as a writer, and that was AWESOME.. Firefly/Serenity I would consider space opera, and that was well done.

I would say I write a bit of space opera, but I like to refer to it as sci-fi lite. I'm not a scientist. I dont know how things work, speeds of light, relativity and suchlike. But I find space tp be fun. So, I have 'down' in my space-ships, and gravity. I make up something that makes it happen, dont explain it in scientific detail, and just move along with the story.

Over-bearing evil faceless governments and empires are going to be everywhere, not just sci fi space operas. Perhaps not dressing them in black, nazi-esque, and having glowing swords or small-moon-sized space stations, might make it a little less cheesy

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Firefly/Serenity I would consider space opera

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In some ways, yes, this is space opera, in the same way that westerns are called 'horse opera'. Big bad government, beautiful heroines, lantern-jawed heroes.

But it also seems waaaay to gritty and dirty to be space opera.

But that's me.

Anyway, as long as you avoid 'actinic beams' (a reference to Doc Smith) and make it fresh and exciting, you're fine.

P.S. Don't tell the editor that it's space opera, so you can avoid the reaction some might give it.

Firefly even had illogic something in the style of EE Doc Smith. The characters fire guns--on space-ships. They stay standing upright through take-off, landing and abrupt manoeuvres--except when the story line dictates that someone loses their balance.

From a writing perspective, I think the scripts are really tight and one can learn much about writing SF from them. Aside from how people talk in real life--Whedon's characters are delightfully philosophical and economical with their words at times of stress.

Why are you all getting hung up on the space sabers?? They have nothing to do with this and I don't plan on using any (well, there will be swords, but they're carried by officers and the individuals in question hate having to lug them everywhere). I was just doing what Robert Nowall hates: adding the word "space" in front of nouns to make them sound futuristic.