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Author Topic: most embarrassing/awesome question ever
micmcd
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So... um... I'm trying to figure out something for my book, I swear. I'd usually go with an epic googling to do my research, but I'm having a hard time determining what qualifies as a reputable source.

This is by far the most awkward question I've put forth to this board, though I'm fairly sure I've had my share of awkward ones. If anyone does have an answer, I am perfectly happy to assume that you found this out in the course of researching for a book. I humbly request that everyone reading also give the benefit of the doubt to those supplying.

The reason I sort of need to know this info is that I have a relative structure of price conversion for my WIP's world, so that I know somebody should pay 4 Marks for a nice tea, 500 marks/month in rent for a reasonable apartment, 50 chips for a newspaper... and... well, characters like this exist in the story, and in fact are important, and I don't want to break believability should the issue come up...

... so the question... wait for it...

... Again, this is for my book. I am not scheduling a trip to Nevada or Amsterdam, nor am I checking my bank account as I see answers...

...
...
How much is a reasonable price for a prostitute to charge in a nation where such activity is legal?

Places I've thought would be reasonable to get this answer are web sites for legal brothels in Nevada, but they tend not to give actual prices (though they are happy to list services on their "menus." And yes, they call them menus). I checked Yelp reviews of some of them (Yes, they exist, and yes, they are hilarious), but those only mention their price range in $ to $$$$ values, and while I have a good idea of what a $$$$ restaurant is... um... not so much for a brothel.


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micmcd
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Protip: please don't get yourself fired by googling around for answers to the question while at work. I promise none of the sites for the brothels I checked (which didn't list prices) are remotely safe for work.
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Zero
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Whatever it would be, it would be less than the going rate where prostitution is illegal.

In general black markets tend to inflate prices because of the additional costs in "offering" the good/service and because it is more scarce.

In a world of legal prostitution, the "service" would be more easy to get (because more people would do it) and therefore the price would be cheaper than it currently is.

You may be thinking that demand would be higher too, because now people who were detered by the threat of going to jail for hiring prostitutes will now come out of the woodwork and start hiring and ... I suppose that's probably true.

But if I had to guess, I'd say the price would most likely go down and not up.


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micmcd
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My goal here is to avoid mentioning something where someone might read it and say "holy crap, you think someone's going to pay the price of a horse for one night?" or "she's going to cost more than a gallon of milk - come on now."

And I really have very little idea of what that range is.


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andersonmcdonald
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sure, micmcd. Got you. Sounds like one of those "I know this guy, who knows this guy..." kind of things. But seriously I have no idea. If you think you've been ripped off, maybe you can take legal action. <GRIN>

[This message has been edited by andersonmcdonald (edited July 26, 2010).]


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MartinV
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Why is this an awkward question? We are all adults here, are we not?
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micmcd
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We are all adults here. But seriously, if one of my friends (we're all adults) asked, "Hey guys, just out of curiosity, does anyone know how much a hooker costs?" I (and all of my friends) would relentlessly mock him for days.

Though it might have been a funnier way to start a discussion thread, a single post asking "Anybody know a standard price for a hooker?" might read a bit... oddly.


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tchernabyelo
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Well, if it's legal, then you can arguably take the cost/cut of pimps, protection, bribes, and even possibly a drug habit (many prostitutes do what they do to pay for a drug habit: the usual "rule" is that men steal, while women whore) out of the equation.

So look at it simply from the point of view of the cost of living, of hourly pay for (say) semi-skillled workers, and extrapolate it out from that.

Prices will always vary, though, because of supply and demand, perceived uality, nature of customer, etc. Looking at current/illegal prostitution in the Western world, you've got everything from crack/meth whores desperate for pretty much anything they can get (as, presumably, their clients must be) right up to seriously "high class" escorts/call girls charging thousands per night.


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MAP
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Okay, I really don't know for sure but here is my guess.

I can't see a hooker charging less than $100, and I would think that the upper limit would be well into the thousands. So my guess is between $100 to 10,000.


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Merlion-Emrys
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quote:
Why is this an awkward question? We are all adults here, are we not?


This is America Martin. Or rather, a majority of the folks here are American. Anything having to do with sex is considered awkward even among adults. And since here prostitution is both illegal and seen by many as a last sexual resort for men that cant "get a girl"...yeah it could be awkward.


Its a very GOOD question though and one to which I have no answer. My only guess would be to try and check out stuff from countries where it is legal.


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Gan
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It depends on the 'quality' of the goods. (This sounds so terrible, I know).

I've done a bit of research on this subject in regards to a character I planned to use in one of my novels.

Generally prostitutes offer different levels of service. Without getting into the details, the more taboo the service the more it will cost. There's also what's called, in the business, "The Girlfriend Experience", often abbreviated by "GFE". This type of service includes kissing, and often french kissing. Because of this, it tends to run higher in price.

You also need to consider the area, and the time period. Nowadays there are entire websites devoted to reviews of prostitutes (As odd is it might sound). A great deal of prostitution these days is found via digital means, rather than the old school method.

You could expect anywhere from $150-$400 an hour for the uh... 'Mid-range' folks. The more 'beautiful' the girl, the higher she will typically 'price' herself. Often women offer 'nightly' deals, which run from $1000-3000 for the 'mid-range' folk. The price also varies depending on how well the prostitute knows/likes the client.

Escort services are essentially the modern day pimps. They send the girls out -- You pay them, and then 'tip' the girl. Doing it this method would be more expensive than through the Independents, but the client is more assured to not be blackmailed or robbed.

In essence, the price is calculated like this:
More risky (Less protection; kissing)? PRICE UP
More fetishistic? PRICE UP
Pimp/escort? PRICE UP
Beauty? PRICE UP
Younger age? PRICE UP

To further complicate things, some girls offer 'quickies', which are lower priced. Though typically the girls that offer quickies are not of 'high quality'.

Hopefully none of this was too explicit. I'll state again that I know all of this from research.

That being said, start the jokes at my expense. :P

Edit: Also, in regards to tchernabyelo's comment about drugs; this is very true amongst prostitutes. But it's important to remember, in that scenario, also the addictiveness of the drug. I've never, for example, heard of a woman whoring herself out for weed, as it has no physical addiction. Drugs with harder physical addictions, rather than mental only, would typically be the ones you'd find prostitutes trying to pay for.

Note that I'm not saying weed is non-addictive, or that it's healthy. My point is that it just doesn't have the physical addiction that the harder drugs tend to have.

[This message has been edited by Gan (edited July 26, 2010).]

[This message has been edited by Gan (edited July 26, 2010).]

[This message has been edited by Gan (edited July 26, 2010).]


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axeminister
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[Even this message has been edited by Gan (edited July 26, 2010).]
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Gan
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Hahah. Yeah sorry. I kept thinking of new things to add, and then spelling it all wrong. I shouldn't post things when I'm tired...
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Merlion-Emrys
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Shouldn't you be creating the universe or something Gan?
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micmcd
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quote:

This is America Martin. Or rather, a majority of the folks here are American. Anything having to do with sex is considered awkward even among adults. And since here prostitution is both illegal and seen by many as a last sexual resort for men that cant "get a girl"...yeah it could be awkward.


Its a very GOOD question though and one to which I have no answer. My only guess would be to try and check out stuff from countries where it is legal.


Do you mean to imply that if my buddies and I were Belgian, we wouldn't relentlessly mock the guy who innocently asked for the going price of a whore? We sure made fun of my Irish roommate for less than that years ago. I understand that there are more relaxed attitudes towards all things sexual in Europe and other areas, but I refuse to believe that guys stop being immature and treat their friends with kindness in other cultures. We're still guys. If Pierre asks Jean-Luc what a low range hooker costs, Jean-Luc would be more than happy to reference the last price he was charged by Pierre's mom. Some setups you just can't walk away from.

Incidentally, prostitution isn't illegal everywhere in the US. It's legit in Nevada, provided you're operating out of a licensed brothel and comply with a long list of state laws.


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Merlion-Emrys
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I was talking about awkwardness. Discussion of anything sexual is awkward in most parts of American culture...much more so than in Europe.

The embarrasment about prostitution specifically is probably more universal, but mostly I was just playing off the fact that Martin (who is Slovenian I believe) often tends to be surprised by things like that that are to some extent artifacts of american culture, econmics, morality etc.


Yeah, I know its legal in Nevada. But I think being illegal in 49 out of 50 states more or less counts as being illegal in American (and if I remember correctly it is, ironically, illegal in Vegas as well so its not even all of Nevada.)


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walexander
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One thing of note about hard drugs coming into play. Often if someone buys hard drugs on a regular basis, the dealers have girls they lend out for free. Many gangs work by this method, and that is why drugs and prostitution go hand in hand.

Straight from the real world. I'll leave it secret if I excepted.

Walking down the street. Lady looks like she missing her fix. Offers $20 BJ

Sitting at Hotel bar. Nice looking gal asks if I want to have a good time: Cost $100

Sitting in another hotel bar. Gal says buy the room and the drinks the rest is on the house.

Several times at the clubs, make friends by buying drinks, time goes by, find myself with the wrong crowd being offered drugs and girls, offer is: buy the drugs, and girls are free.

The most expensive offer I ever heard. Hanging out at an upscale lounge, suit and tie, the cream of the crop, beautiful lady comes up and asks if I want to join there dating service: Cost $3000.
No sex provided! It was a real dating service. I said--do you know how many hookers I could get for that!

My 2cents,

W.


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Kathleen Dalton Woodbury
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Levitt and Dubner discuss the economics of prostitution (among a lot of other things) in their book SUPERFREAKONOMICS.
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shimiqua
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I think you will also want to consider the culture of a place that has legalized prostitution.

1, How long has prostitution been legal. If it's for 100+ years, then the price would be really high, I think. (Inflation) If it is just in the last 20+ years, then the prostitutes you would get would be the dregs of the world. However if it is an accepted position, then there would be a level of respect for the position, and only the most beautiful and higher class ladies would be available, and then a night with one would cost probably about the amount of one space ship. I would say.

2, is there a Union? What rights does the prostitute have according to the legalization? For example, a union of prostitutes could protect the younger by setting the price freakishly high.

3, Why did they legalize it? This effects not only the rights of the ladies, but the culture of the entire civilization, and, of course, the PRICE.

4, How would one become a prostitute in the world of your story? Is it just a show up on the right corner in your trashiest, or is it something you would have to go to college for? (I can just imagine the names of those classes.)Is it something that you would have to test into, or is it a club with membership dues?

5, STD's. How are they protected against, and what is the effect?

6, Also, how do male prostitutes differ from female in the world of your story?

Anyway, good luck, and have fun. But not.... okay, whatever.
~Sheena


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MartinV
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quote:
The embarrasment about prostitution specifically is probably more universal, but mostly I was just playing off the fact that Martin (who is Slovenian I believe) often tends to be surprised by things like that that are to some extent artifacts of american culture, econmics, morality etc.

Wow, some people actually remember where I'm from.

True, some info about US surprises me. When I hear about the amount of crime and shooting (in one other thread on this very forum, people calmly suggested that I should buy a gun when staying in US) I am quite surprised to find Americans honestly shy when it comes to sex. Compared to that, Americans believe all Europeans are sex freaks. How many times have I heard stories that go: "Hi, my name is Pierre. I'm from Paris. I've come to have sex with your family."

I'm no sex addict and I've never tried to hire a prostitute. But we are writers and writers need to gather information about the real world. It seems strange that if someone asks about tariff for a hooker people look at you and laugh at you (as a side note, if friends would mock me the way some people described here, they would not be my friends for long). But if you ask about application of torture devices, for instance, everyone is calm and rational.

Opinions anyone?


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Meredith
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The United States has never, to this day, completely overcome its Puritan beginnings. We're backward, that way (me included). When you think about it rationally, it makes no sense, but it's how most of us were raised and we're stuck with it.

The very fact that it is still something of a taboo subject is what makes it the material for "locker room" type humor. Boys will be boys, whether there is a locker room or not.

BTW, I think the suggestion that you buy a gun when moving to Texas was intended as a joke. At least, I think it was. I'm reasonably certain that it's possible to live even in Texas without owning a gun. Then again, I've never lived there and I don't think the length of time I spent in the Houston airport counts.


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Meredith
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Back to the subject of this post.

Have you considered calling the police department? Bet they know the going rates. Tell them you're a writer doing research for a novel and you'd rather ask them than the alternative.

[This message has been edited by Meredith (edited July 28, 2010).]


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tchernabyelo
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Except that the subject of this post is about what prostituion costs would be if it were legal.

Gan, you might want to look at the situation in the Netherlands - Amsterdam is known for its red light district, though I can't say exactly what is and is not legal there.

Historically there are also other societies that have legalised prostitution - indeed, in Florence during parts of the Renaissance it was state-sponsored (partly as a counter to the levels of homosexuality which were occurring at the time).


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walexander
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quote:
Have you considered calling the police department? Bet they know the going rates. Tell them you're a writer doing research for a novel and you'd rather ask them than the alternative.

I don't really suggest this move. I worked security for a few years a while back and had a lot of dealings with the officers and vice. Many I knew on a first name basis, and had a beer on occasion with. There very touchy about the law, and there own inner circle, and naturally they deal with all shorts of people talking all kinds of stories. So unless you can say-- I'm such-and-such writer--have you read any of my books or stories? It will probably take getting to know one of them personally before broaching such a question. Saying I'm a writer doesn't carry much weight unless you're already published, or well know. Because the same as being an artist telling someone I'd like to paint you. there are thousands of people who claim these professions as a gimmick, and tarnish the reps. of a true writer/artist.

If you broach such a subject be prepared to be interrogated back, there naturally suspicious and will be looking to discover your ulterior motive, even if it is just for a story.

But just to let you know the way I stayed friends with the one's I know is by not asking them about police business. A slippery-slope for a writer. But saying, "Hey, I'm a writer and was curious for a story I am writing how much does a prostitute go for these days." Probably not the wisest idea.

W.


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Rhaythe
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This has been an entertaining thread to watch.

If nothing else, just make something up that you think your character would be willing to pay. As far as I know, most people have not made that kind of purchase in their life. If your character demands a price that he/she believes is fair, and can justify it, then chances are your reader will go right along with it.

The only ones that might not agree and object would be vice cops and the... professionals... that you are underselling in the story.


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MartinV
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You don't even have to reveal the price as a number. Just make your character say something like: "Wow, that much, huh? That's quite expensive."
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JSchuler
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quote:
The United States has never, to this day, completely overcome its Puritan beginnings. We're backward, that way (me included).

Curious as to how "backward" applies to sexual mores. After all, it's not as if primitive man followed strict practices of celibacy and monogamy that he needed reason to free himself from.

Anyway. If the prostitute is more than 10X the cost of alcohol you would drink with her, it's a rip off.

...

...

That's what I've heard, anyway...


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babooher
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You need to understand that there are differences in types of prostitutes. There is a range.

On one end is the Escort. She charges more and generally appears to be a little more put together. She'll charge by the hour, normally. You might actually take her out in public.

On the other end is the streetwalker. She'll charge less and is often much less presentable. She'll charge by the pop and her rates will depend on the act. You generally do not want to be caught dead with her in public.

Usually, streetwalkers will between $30 and $50 depending on the act. The reason why I say $30 is because the odds of you having a ten are much less than you having two twenties. She won't have change.

Escorts aren't going to charge less than $100 an hour and that's cheap.


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geronl
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I do not know whether the price would be higher or lower than if it were illegal. I do know that in Australia they are unionized so that raises the price for sure.

I also read that 20% of underage girls in Japan try prostitution, with their perverted pop culture this is sad but not shocking and mentioned one girl who sold herself at a huge discount because she was a virgin (roll eyes).


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Lionhunter
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quote:

I also read that 20% of underage girls in Japan try prostitution, with their perverted pop culture this is sad but not shocking and mentioned one girl who sold herself at a huge discount because she was a virgin (roll eyes).

lulwhat?


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dee_boncci
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I've hear of high class "ladies" who can get on the order of $1000 (USD)/night with a single client (like the ones who worked for the notorious madam in Washington DC a couple years back). I've seen one of the "Cops"-type television shows where stereotype "street walkers" in big cities were asking $15-20 for specific services. That's just two heresay data points. Then you get into the various "sugar daddy" type of arrangements and I have no clue what they would demand.

So there are a lot of factors

Here's an approach. If prostitution is largely accepted and commonly practiced in the story culture, it would probably evolve like any other commodity. Wherever there is a demand for something people will part with their money to get, someone will create a supply. So there would in effect be levels of prostitution that mirror the economic strata of their prospective clients. Some might be in a position to demand quite a lot of money from the very wealthy, some only a little from the poorest class. People in your would probably seek out the best they could afford. Maybe something like 10% of a month's pay if it's an occasional thing (roughly what I might spend for a big night on the town with a good meal and a concert and drinks afterword for myself and a guest) They might spend more if it's an only once a year thing, less if it's a weekly thing.

What customers are willing/able to pay is what will ultimately set the price.


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XD3V0NX
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I have not read all the replies, so this might be a bit random, but it would be pretty funny if you could buy hookers on the dollar menu, like at mcdonalds. They'd just have a store all on it's own for hookers. Hahah. Sorry, I just got done watching Super Bad, which is an awesome and super funny movie.
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