posted
Ok, this is very nerve racking for me and now I have butterflies in my stomach. This is my first attempt at a novel. It's a fantasy story. I've been working on it for almost a year and am at 80,000 words. I've written the first draft all the way through but it was a quick write, kind of like the bare bones of the story. Now I'm rewriting it completely for the second time and fleshing out the story. This is the third attempt at the beginning. I'm wondering if it makes you want to turn the page, and any advice you can give would be wonderful. I counted out the first thirteen lines from where it's written on my computer in word. I hope that's right. Gulp, here it is.
Marlin stood looking out at the dirt road below. He was in his private room on the top floor with the window flung wide. It was the middle of the day and the sun sent a shaft of light into the otherwise murky room. John was finally on his way. The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair that hung to his shoulders so that it seemed glow. He had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and would be ready to help Marlin complete his revenge. His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer to his revenge. It was always in steps. They seemed like baby steps. He had been so patient in the beginning and now that it was close it was beginning to wear on him. He could still feel his anger white hot like it
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 14, 2008).]
posted
"window flung wide" seemed a bit overly dramatic.
The rest seems very repetitive. You name him and point to his motivation repeatedly.
I don't think I'd read further, but I think I might could be persuaded if it were a bit more succinct. My view is that usually things can be twice as good for being half as long.
I do remain curious and would be happy to read the first chapter if you wanted.
quote:Ok, this is very nerve racking for me and now I have butterflies in my stomach.[[Strong voice. It really serves to build characterization]] This is my first attempt at a novel. It's a fantasy story. I've been working on it for almost a year and am at[[and it's reached...perhaps]] 80,000 words. I've written the first draft all the way through but it was a quick write[,][[Consider an em dash here]] kind of like the bare bones of the story. Now I'm rewriting it completely for the second time and fleshing out the story. This is the third attempt at the beginning. I'm wondering if it makes you want to turn the page, and any advice you can give would be wonderful. I counted out the first thirteen lines from where it's written on my computer in word. I hope that's right. Gulp, here it is.
Oh you want a critique on this
quote:Marlin stood looking out at the dirt road below. He was in his private room on the top floor with the window flung wide. [[Combine these two sentences and work on condensing them concisely]]It was the middle of the day and the sun sent a shaft of light into the otherwise murky room. Does he have a window in the ceiling? It seems that a shaft of light would come from an earlier tme of day when the sun was at an angle with the window. John was finally on his way. The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair that hung to his shoulders so that it seemed glow.[[POV]] He had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and would be ready to help Marlin complete his revenge. His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer to his revenge. It was always in steps. They seemed like baby steps. He had been so patient in the beginning and now that it was I cut it here because you posted a few lines too many
This seemed a little busy and some of the voice seemed passive, but I will be glad to go over it in more detail if you want to send over a chapter.
Welcome to Hatrack. At the risk of being obvious, you just have to click the little mail icon above this post which will direct you to my email address.
[This message has been edited by Idiot savant- the savant (edited July 13, 2008).]
[This message has been edited by Bent Tree (edited July 13, 2008).]
The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair that hung to his shoulders so that it seemed glow.
What seemed to glow? The light or Marlin's hair? The image is a little drab.
He had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and would be ready to help Marlin complete his revenge. His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer to his revenge.
Too much revenge. All of this could be said in one sentence.
It was always in steps. They seemed like baby steps. baby cliche
He had been so patient in the beginning and now that it was close it was beginning to wear on him.Too many things are beginning in this sentence.
He could still feel his anger white hot like it had been that very first day he had been betrayed. white colored, heated anger is another cliche. It's even the title of a song by a terrible band named RAVEN: http://www.kovideo.net/lyrics/r/Raven/White-Hot-Anger.html
The day everything was taken from him, his wife, his house, his money, his life. This is a run-on and an awkward, ill described flashback.
He would never know peace until it was settled. It seemed like forever to wait, but he was a patient man, so he had dealt with it. Now that it was near the end the waiting was beginning to chafe. chafe what? Also saying he had dealt with it, when he hasn't fully dealt with it yet is awkward.
As it stands I don't think I would read on. I would suggest that you dip back into the sub-text of the story and make it seem more real, a little less cliche. I kept picturing a scene from an 80s movie. I don't think this is terrible by any means, I just think you need to go back and paint it with some more details and freshness.
Marlin stood looking out at the dirt road below. He was in his private room on the top floor with the window flung wide. It was the middle of the day and the sun sent a shaft of light into the otherwise murky room. John was finally on his way. The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair that hung to his shoulders so that it seemed glow. He had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and everything would be in readiness. His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer. He turned around to see his brother, Victor, standing in the middle of the room. He was standing there with that look of superiority Marlin had found annoying since they were both kids. It was Victor who had convinced him
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 14, 2008).]
posted
I'm going to edit this, to where it might look better. I'm no expert at being an editor but I think this might help you flesh everything out.
Marlin threw open the window in his private room as he looked out at the dirt road below. It was mid day as the sun shone into his murky room. He was on his way. The light made Marlin’s shoulder length blond hair glow. He had been waiting most of his life to finally complete his revenge. After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and everything would be in readiness. His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer. A noise made him turn around to see his brother, Victor was standing there with that look of superiority Marlin had found annoying since they were both kids. It was Victor who had convinced him to wait to get his revenge. He would have finished it already if it wasn’t for him.
That is a little better. The others will do better but there are sentences in this post that says the same thing that you are trying to state with the bigger ones. Sometimes a shorter sentence is better then an overly long one.
Beth
[This message has been edited by BethBrownell (edited July 13, 2008).]
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 14, 2008).]
Most of the things I hit on below are first draft issues. Editing should clean a lot of this up.
It's not working for me because there is no real POV and you're telling us backstory. I wouldn't turn the page.
Let's see if I can show you what I mean:
quote:Marlin stood looking out at the dirt road below. a bit passive but okay
He was in his private room on the top floor with the window flung wide. who is telling me this? Marlin? Why would he be thinking about it
It was the middle of the day and the sun sent a shaft of light into the otherwise murky room. Same problem IMHO. This isn't anyone's POV, it's you setting the scene
John was finally on his way. YES, something to move the story even if it's an oddly plain name after a MC named Marlin
The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair that hung to his shoulders so that it seemed glow. Rats! Story is stalled while the author tells me the MC's phyical description. Who is seeing this to know his hair seemed to glow. Why aren't I seeing the anticipation of John coming home? BTW- right now for no good reason I'm thinking the two are lovers
He had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. WHAT? don't withhold
After this errand, John, his son, would finally be finished with his training and everything would be in readiness. What on about three levels. What errand - Marlin knows so don't withhold. What training? What would be in readiness?
His son would return and Marlin would be one step closer. To WHAT? Okay, too much teasing by withholding, I'm going to put this down soon
He turned around to see his brother, Victor, standing in the middle of the room. Was he here all along? Hu?
He was standing there with that look of superiority Marlin had found annoying since they were both kids. Why am I being told this now? Get to the revenge and training and plans
It was Victor who had convinced him I'm done.
People don't think this way. Marlin thinks something like "Once John has taken the oath of the Dragon Wizards I can get back at old Victor." Just tell me for goodness sake. Right now I have no idea what's going on and no reason to care because I have no character to identify with.
Before you run away screaming, put this in a drawer for a bit, then read it and flesh it out some more. Sink into someone's head. Only tell me what they see and how thier POV colors that event. Have fun editing, writing the first draft was the easy part.
posted
Take a deep breath. Read through everything objectively, and be sure this is not to say "you suck", because it's not. Though the comments can seem biting, they are only to help you.
That said (I'm tweaking from that, you know), here's My take:
quote: Marlin stood looking out at the dirt road below. [Why? What does this matter? How does it progress either the story or character?] He was in his private room on the top floor with the window [flung wide<--[This is a bit much; besides how could he look out of a "closed" window? Maybe a brief description of the kind of window would help set the time/era/milieu, but otherwise, hook us first.]. It was the middle of the day and the sun sent a shaft of light into the otherwise murky room.<--[This, along with the other two sentences accomplishes part three of the thought.] John was finally on his way. [Huh? How does he know? Who's John?] The light lit up Marlin’s blond hair [Eh? It did what?] that hung to his shoulders [so that it seemed glow<--[Redundant.]. He [Who?] had been waiting most of his life to complete his revenge. [Who's revenge? What revenge? Against Who?] After this errand, John, his son[Who's son?], would finally be finished with his training [What training?] and everything would be in readiness. His son[Is this another person or John? What does Marlin think of him as? That's what you should use.] would return and Marlin would be one step closer [Dragging it out.]. He turned around to see his brother, Victor, standing in the middle of the room. [Wen and how did he get there?] He was standing there with that look of superiority<--[Redundant, and the "look of superiority" doesn't add much.] Marlin had found [Him?] annoying since they [were both<--Suggest:had been] kids. It was Victor who had convinced him
Okay, what I'm missing is what revenge and against whom. The rest could be trimmed and cleaned up. A little more characterization would go a long way toward cleaning out redundacies. What I gleaned could be exposed in half the prose. Here's a rough example (I'm sure it's riddled with errors in the story):
Marlin gripped a scroll behind his back and paced his chamber, looping his brother Victor and peering out the window. The sun was setting and his guards would admit no one--not even his son--after dark. Where was Johnny? Marlin resisted the urge to chew his fingernails, such was not proper behavior for sorcerors, and he wouldn't give Victor the satisfaction. Victor wore his usual smug look, he probably wanted Johnny to fail, he never could stand to see Marlin happy. Well Johnny woulndn't fail, he'd complete his mission and complete the rite of passage that would make him a sorceror, and Victor would only scowl as Marlin set his revenge in motion--a revenge that had fueled him for the better part of his life.
Hope this helps. And good luck with this.
[This message has been edited by InarticulateBabbler (edited July 16, 2008).]
posted
Thank you for everyone's critique. It's hard to hear it, but it's very helpful and I completely agree with it. Thanks for taking the time to do it. I had been thinking about what it needed for a couple of days and I was feeling like it was lacking on POV which is just what Kings Falcon said. But you said it in a more concise way that helped me understand what was nagging in the back of my head. Also I liked inarticulate babblers take too. So thanks. I'm definetly needing to do another draft here. I'm not sure if I'm going to keep this scene. I'm feeling like scrapping this one and doing something different, but who knows. I've had a hard time with the beginning. Nothing seems to fit well. No fear though I'm sure it'll come to me. Thanks again.
posted
satate, ask yourself when the main character becomes involved (decides or is forced to do something about what is happening) in the story you are telling. Maybe that will give you an idea of where and how to start?
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posted
I totally agree with Kings_Falcon and InarticulateBabbler so I won't repeat their well stated comments.
Sometimes the first chapter is for you and you alone. (for me the first 6 chapters of my first novel got the axe. They live only on my harddrive in a file I call misc babbling) The hardest part is showing without telling. Your first 13 are telling. Whereas the rewrite from the last post was showing. There was tension and action, suspense.
Start with action. Then throw in more action and when the character can't take any more...yup, throw in another action. Look at Rachel Caine or even (not that I actually like her storyline but the writing techniques are sublime)Laurel K. Hamilton.
Could you begin the chapter at another point farther in? In world building there is a lot you write and plan that turns out to only be for you. Backstory I think it is called.
Kidnapping wasn’t a big deal. John had done worse. He scanned the small common room of the inn. He couldn’t see the innkeeper. He tapped his foot in a steady rhythm against the wood floor. He had asked for a meal ten minutes ago and it still wasn’t out. At least there were only a few people in the room with him. This village was too small for his needs. He needed a good sized town where one person missing wouldn’t be as noticed. A portly man with salt and pepper hair came from the kitchen carrying a steaming bowl of stew and a piece of bread. John wondered what the innkeeper would say if he admitted to being a sorcerer? Probably run away screaming, and then gather the townsfolk to get rid of him. The innkeeper set the bowl of stew and bread in front of John and smiled too
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited July 18, 2008).]
posted
Much better, I only have a few major nits (all in the last part):
quote:The innkeeper set the bowl of stew and bread in front of John and smiled (too big<--[Strange wording. You might make this a separate thought. Your first line was the hook and it's only gotten deeper since.]. John pushed a piece of silver to the man.<--[Again strange choice of words. "Pushed a piece of silver to the man" is odd. "Handed him", "tossed him", but pushed?] He[[Who?] picked it up [From what?] and bowed his head over steepled hands in thanks. John wished the man would just go back to his kitchen. The innkeeper lingered a moment and opened his mouth as if to ask something. He[Who?] glared at him[Who?] to encourage him to leave. It worked.
Other than that, it works. Finish what you are writing and then clean it up.
posted
Thank you, I didn't see those. Which I guess is why we have others read our work. But yes, thank you that helped.
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quote: Kidnapping wasn’t a big deal. John had done worse. He scanned the small common room of the inn. He couldn’t see the innkeeper. He tapped his foot in a steady rhythm against the wood floor. He had asked for a meal ten minutes ago and it still wasn’t out. At least there were only a few people in the room with him. Why is this a good thing? This village was too small for his needs. He needed a good sized town where one person missing wouldn’t be as noticed. A portly man with salt and pepper hair came from the kitchen carrying a steaming bowl of stew and a piece of bread. John wondered what the innkeeper would say if he admitted to being a sorcerer? <-- should be a period. This feels like a cheap and easy way to introduce that your character is a sorcerer. I'd save this and try to find a more natural way of introducing that, like having him perform magic. Probably run away screaming, and then gather the townsfolk to get rid of him. The innkeeper set the bowl of stew and bread in front of John and smiled too
I pointed out above the number of times you begin sentences with "He" just in these first thirteen. Sentence variation = happy reader. I'm also wondering where the action is going to come from: you start out saying that John is going to kidnap someone, but then John rejects the eligibility of this town for his kidnapping plot. So...what's the action? As a reader, I'd probably lose interest, since you've just told me that (presumably) nothing exciting is about to happen in this opening scene except that John will get his soup late and maybe yell at the innkeeper.
Hope that helps. By comparison, it's miles better than the first.
[This message has been edited by Jesse D (edited July 18, 2008).]
quote: I pointed out above the number of times you begin sentences with "He" just in these first thirteen. Sentence variation = happy reader.
As long as we know whom to attribute the "he" to it's alright. You may want to not start many sentecnes with "He", but using he to keep the PoV "invisible" is fine. Varying names for the PoV gets confusing, and it makes for an unhappy reader.
posted
Right. My complaint isn't with using the pronoun.Pronouns are our friends. It makes the selection stilted and choppy when every sentence starts with it, though.
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posted
Thanks Jesse. After rereading it the "He" at the beginning of each sentence really bugged me. But I just tweaked a few so it wouldn't start with He in everyone. I found a few I could simply take out the He and then it felt a lot better.
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It is a good start but as it was mentioned before it is a little repetitive ("Complete his Revenge" is mentioned twice in two sequential sentences). I would be happy to read the first chapter for you and we could swap my first if you want? I'm finishing a reedit before I email it to you if you're still interested.
posted
Yea, sure Lynk. I'd like that. I'm re-editting my first chapter also, but we could swap. That'd be great. Oh, also you read the old first thirteen lines. I've updated it. Posts: 968 | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
Here's my shot. It may be a teensy bit over 13 lines, but...
---------
Marlin stared out the open window to the dusty street below. Where are you?
"Is the boy not back yet?"
Victor. Marlin spun around so the loose hair swished on his bare neck. He waited until his eyes adjusted to the gloom. Victor stood in the door, his superiority manifest in that cruel smile.
"My son... John is not a boy." Marlin squared himself to his younger brother. "Today is the day."
"Yes I know about his trial. Maybe he will succeed. I hope so." The smile had turned to a sneer.
Marlin turned back to the window. "He will pass his test." He had to. Marlin's long-overdue revenge depended on it.
---------
Jump straight into the action somewhere. It might start better with John in the inn. But why would I be sympathetic to someone who's planning to randomly kidnap someone just to see if he could do it?
posted
Ooh! And you're a conceited one, too, Inarticulate Babbler.
I could have sworn I directed that post to jdt.
But, if the shoe fits....
By the way, how do you think skadder would react to the idea of running a "rewrite someone else's 13 lines" challenge, or two, or six?
Of course, people would have to volunteer their 13 lines (perhaps taken from the 13 line challenges already done?), but they could decide which one was the best rewrite.
posted
I don't know about how skadder would feel, but there are far cooler 13s that have been posted in F&F--though I totally agree with the permission being granted first.
quote:Ooh! And you're a conceited one, too, Inarticulate Babbler.
LMAO!!! I wasn't attempting conceit, just showing that jdt wasn't the only guilty party...sheesh--that didn't come off humble. LoL. But, yeah...the shoe sometimes fits too well. (Incidentally, I admitted well in advance--a sort of disclaimer--that I was an ass. I guess I should amend that to conceited ass.)
posted
This is an extremely random thought, but I think the line "John wondered what the innkeeper would say if he admitted to being a sorcerer?" would make a good first sentence. I thought the first two you used in the latest revision were good too, though, so this was in no way a criticism of them. Just an idea that popped into my head and I thought I'd throw it there. Keep up the good work. Best regards,
What I meant to illustrate is that I'd like to see the story show the elements instead of being told what they are. I'll try to do that another way next time.
[This message has been edited by jdt (edited July 22, 2008).]
posted
jdt, it's a real temptation, which is why I'm thinking it might be fun to allow people to do it as a writing challenge.
We're here to learn how to "edit" (as in critique/give feedback) as well as how to write, because most writers will end up doing more editing (of their own work) than they will writing, if they're going to get anywhere. The thing is, rewriting someone else's story should only be done as a kind of last resort, when you can't explain your feedback to the writer in any other way. (Sometimes, writers ask for such examples, and that's different.)
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