posted
I wouldn't celebrate just yet. I believe in God but these things come in waves. One year athiesm is on the rise, the next it is at an all time low. Just like all religions its high times and low times fluctuate.
Posts: 832 | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
I agree, Jay. However I think the idea of "having religion" is at the same time changing. I know many people who when asked about their religion would not give it as atheism but would not name a specific religion, or if they did would have a "relgion with conditions".
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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quote: Writes Turkish philosopher Harun Yahya, "Atheism, which people have tried to for hundreds of years as 'the ways of reason and science,' is proving to be mere irrationality and ignorance."
Now there an overstatement if I ever read one.
quote: As British philosopher Anthony Flew, once as hard-nosed a humanist as any, mused when turning his back on his former belief: It is, for example, impossible for evolution to account for the fact than one single cell can carry more data than all the volumes of the Encyclopedia Britannica put together.
So a philospher has declared what is possible in a hard science. Show me a respectable biologist who will declare this and maybe you'll have something worth reading.
quote: A few years ago, European scientists sniggered when studies in the United States – for example, at Harvard and Duke universities – showed a correlation between faith, prayer and recovery from illness. Now 1,200 studies at research centers around the world have come to similar conclusions, according to "Psychologie Heute," a German journal, citing, for example, the marked improvement of multiple sclerosis patients in Germany's Ruhr District due to "spiritual resources."
Another highly questionable claim presented as if it were now a settled fact. I'd need to see some hard data on this because the last time I looked into the subject the "experiments" used to show this were hopelessly without any real controls. Indeed the whole concept of a controlled study on the effects of prayers is pretty funny. How many children, and even adults go to bed at night petitioning "God bless those in need"?
But my favorite has to be this:
quote: Atheism's other Achilles heel are the acts on inhumanity and lunacy committed in its name. As McGrath relates in Christianity Today: "With time (atheism) turned out to have just as many frauds, psychopaths, and careerists as religion does. ... With Stalin and Madalyn Murray O'Hair, atheism seems to have ended up mimicking the vices of the Spanish Inquisition and the worst televangelists, respectively."
Athiesm is fatally flawed because it's just as capable of creating monsters as Christianity? If you're gonna throw a stone through the opposition's window, one might first want to open their own window. If you accept this as a valid point, it does as much damage to the religious viewpoint as the atheistic.
Basically a fluff article and not a very good one.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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posted
What is that source, Jay - the World Tribune? I'm unfamiliar with it. Is it writing to a Christian audience?
I ask because sentiments like this between Christians confuse me. The way most sects view the years to come does not include a huge global acceptance of Christianity, at least if you follow the Book of Revelation. What, then, is the article aiming at? Are we supposed to be congratulating the fall of Atheism or being warned about the perils of this new pagan spirituality? And I'd wonder how they define pagan. They don't seem to have much trouble quoting a Muslim philosopher, but would his brand of theism be included in the list of frightening pagan beliefs the article later warns about?
Posts: 8504 | Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Oh, wow. Jay, is this the kind of article you actually rely on for information, or do you just dig it up to reinforce your existing biases?
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
The worst proreligious biased thing I have ever seen was creation magazine, ever seen it? It was like a religious tabloid it was so bad and their is this one youth leader at my church who lives by it. I love pushing her buttons... Posts: 832 | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
I'm kind of curious what's supposed to happen on Farmgirl's link. All I get is a black box, apparently affiliated with a mediocre metal band in some way.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
I don’t know much about World Tribune really. Other then I see some of their articles referenced every now and then. I got the link off of Drudge. I did find this about section on their website: http://www.worldtribune.com/WorldTribune/owner.htmlPosts: 2845 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
Hmmm... Tom. I think that page is Flash or something -- probably something you have blocked since I know how much you hate Flash
But yes, it is about a hard rock band. One of the major members of the band (it is one of these bands that has the word "explicit" by all their songs on Amazon) has chosen to accept Jesus Christ, and has left the band to pursue that alternative path....
Posts: 9538 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Why the heck would Drudge link to this piece? It's not that I'm doubting he did -- I can clearly see that he did -- but rather that I'm curious about his motivations.
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"One of the major members of the band (it is one of these bands that has the word 'explicit' by all their songs on Amazon) has chosen to accept Jesus Christ, and has left the band to pursue that alternative path...."
More power to 'im. Now if only the rest of the band would find Jesus, modern rock radio might become marginally more tolerable.
posted
Personally, I'd rather be associated with a religious group in the minority that was known for actively practicing our doctrine than have 82% of Americans claim they belonged. The number of people who identify with your religion says nothing about its veracity.
Posts: 8504 | Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
Yes. Yes, Jay. I'm sure that's it. I wonder if you can buy little pennants with "Yay, God!" on them. I can think of many situations in which they would be useful, and I'm sure God would appreciate the gesture.
posted
Nah. See, I don't need a "Go America" pennant. I need a "Go God" pennant. I couldn't care less whether God's on America's side, as long as God wins.
quote:Maybe because it’s a good story about the hopeful future of our planet.
The flip side of that, is that it is a bad story about how our planet is now moving back into the dark ages when religion dominated people's lives. Please. Give me a break.
Posts: 3295 | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
"that it is a bad story about how our planet is now moving back into the dark ages when religion dominated people's lives"
Nah. For one thing, we have Burger King and reality TV now. The church will never play as prominent a role in society ever again, if just for those two reasons.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
Just remember that a belief in no god is still a belief. So to speak of religion includes this belief just like it includes beliefs that include multiple gods.
Posts: 832 | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote: For one thing, we have Burger King and reality TV now. The church will never play as prominent a role in society ever again, if just for those two reasons.
posted
Do people actually spend money on God Bless America pennants? And anxiously await their arrival?
Posts: 8504 | Registered: Aug 1999
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posted
That's not actually accurate O7P (yeah you know me!). While people who frame their beliefs specifically in opposition to their being a god still have a belief in this domain, saying that all people have to is like saying that all people have a religious belief that there isn't a giant purple space panda that controls our destiny or that there aren't an infinite number of turtles standing on each other's backs holding up the world.
However, if you try, I have faith that you can reconstitute Pascal's Wager here. Because somebody's gotta.
posted
Well, they haven't released it yet, but I heard that some scientists at Los Alamos found an even smaller particle that makes up quarks and that carved into the side of each one is "God was here."
Posts: 10177 | Registered: Apr 2001
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I have never seen anything remotely convincing in scientific creationism. But I respect that if you take the Bible literally and believe it to be strong evidence for creationism, the facts can be interpreted according to that bias.
After all, we all interpret the facts according to our own biases. I have no problem with that.
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Sadly, unlike most campers, God didn't leave a date so we can't yet settle whether the Earth is a few thousand or billion years old.
Posts: 3243 | Registered: Apr 2002
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"atheism is going downhill because it's losing its scientific underpinnings"
The logic here: Many stupid people confuse evolutionary theory with atheism. They often don't realize that it's possible to believe in one without believing in the other. The recent attempt by creationists to reposition Christian creationism under the broader umbrella of pseudoscientific "intelligent design" lets them pretend to themselves that there's somehow more science in their belief than there used to be.
quote:"The time is fast approaching when many people who are living in ignorance with no knowledge of their Creator will be graced by faith in the impending post-atheist world."
Oh yes... it all makes sense now. I accept Jesus as my Lord and Personal Saviour. Posts: 4953 | Registered: Jan 2004
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quote: For one thing, find me an atheist who doesn’t believe in evolution.
That is only because evolution is *incredibly* convincing and atheists have no biased reason not to believe in it.
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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"For one thing, find me an atheist who doesn’t believe in evolution."
What do you consider "evolution," Jay? If you're referring to Darwinian theories of natural selection, there are many atheists who think there are better models out there. Heck, I'd wager a handful of atheists even belong to the intelligent design camp, and believe that an alien seeded life on this planet.
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Farmgirl, please tell me you're not really citing those as convincing arguments. The site to which you've linked is so incredibly shameless that it suggests that scientists are driven to believe in evolution not because it's the best theory out there, but because most scientists are atheists and atheists need to believe in a non-divine creator.
*laugh* Which is, unfortunately, something that is only credible to someone who's ignorant enough to already believe it.
posted
I'm just disappointed that us agnostics never get mentioned...it's always Christians this, Muslim's that, atheists there. Seriously though, this article isn't even worth the effort of taking seriously. I'm disappointed that I took the time to read it. That's 3 minutes of my life I'll never get back.
Posts: 1480 | Registered: Dec 2004
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