Do not seriously assume that you don't find in Marine recruiters what you'll also find in recruiters for other branches. That's some blatant home-team bias there, bucko
Bucko? Are you serious? Of course there's a bias. And a little anger too. Honor and integrity are a huge part of the lifestyle, and all some people can do is throw stones from the sidelines. Gah!
Posts: 1156 | Registered: Jan 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Glenn Arnold: My son was harassed by the Marines until he told them he wasn't a 0 on the Kinsey scale. He says the thinks he's about a 1.5.
They didn't really understand what he was talking about, but they stopped calling.
Did he seriously tell them that? That's funny.
I wish there was a way to keep the recruiters out of the high schools. I'm always worried they'll show up at my gun/military infatuated 9-year old's school. He'd follow them any where they'd want him to go.
Posts: 3771 | Registered: Sep 2002
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Yep, he really did. I was in the living room listening to this increasingly weird conversation trying to figure out who on earth he could be talking to.
Boy I don't remember recruiters in high school at all went I was in school. I just remember television commercials.
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote:Do not seriously assume that you don't find in Marine recruiters what you'll also find in recruiters for other branches. That's some blatant home-team bias there, bucko
Bucko? Are you serious? Of course there's a bias. And a little anger too.
I know. It's what is making arguments like yours so shallow: they are visceral, emotional reactions that draw you away from a fair judgment. "what, marines never do that, they aren't the slimy army, go marines think marine hoo-rah" is fun and all but it's easily picked apart.
See, let's talk about me for a minute: I was given some of the most astounding, openly predatory garbage you will ever hear by some USMC recruiters. It makes for a fun story (except for the phone drama) but its use in judging the marines is limited. I generally think the marines are an okay organization, and if I were unable to look beyond the emotional reaction I had to the disgusting recruiting techniques I just happened to have as an anecdotal experience, I wouldn't be able to say that. Today, I dismiss my personal experience and as much as is possible I don't let it color my view of the marines unnecessarily.
So, now look at yourself. You're so full of wounded pride over the subject of the marines just whenever they come up that you automatically take a reactionary standpoint and assume that they have done no wrong, and the same logic leaves you painting your opposition wholeheartedly as people who 'do nothing' but 'throw stones from the sidelines.'
Bzzzt, wrong. The marines are as open to criticism as any other group. Marine recruiters aren't a perfect dove-white honor-bound collective any more than you could say that about Navy or Army recruiters; there's some skullduggery in it all. At the least you could concede the right of americans to protest against military recruitment for a multitude of reasons, perhaps for instance a firm condemnation over the fact that they are discriminatory against homosexuals. This is a legitimate complaint!
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Tangential Question: if I were a single young man, and the draft had just been reinstated, could I just say I was gay (or show some pictures of me hugging a male friend, or whatever), and thus dodge the draft?
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In the face of a draft, the government would probably drop the whole 'no gays' thing (it's on the rocks as it is) but as it stands now I think it's supposed to be as illegal to draft gays as it is to allow gays to enlist.
Residual homophobic governmental practices for the win!
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Ah. Well, luckily for me with respect to the draft, I "have biological problems staying in a ditch for thirty days." Gingrich for the win!
Posts: 2409 | Registered: Sep 2003
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I guess you could also take advice from the most hypocritical draft dodger in the world, Ted Nugent:
quote:He claims that 30 days before his draft board physical, he stopped all forms of personal hygiene. The last 10 days, he ingested nothing but Vienna sausages and Pepsi; and a week before his physical, he stopped using bathrooms altogether, virtually living inside pants caked with his own excrement, stained by his urine. That spectacle won Nugent a deferment, he says. "... but if I would have gone over there, I'd have been killed, or I'd have killed, or I'd killed all the hippies in the foxholes...I would have killed everybody." - Detroit Free Press Magazine , July 15, 1990
posted
I have to imagine that if the draft were ever actually reinstated, they'd draft women too, as they should. I think they should have to register for selective service, but, that probably won't happen for a long time.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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<whine> But Lyrhawn..... I have biological problems with military service. I could catch an infection, or something. Like what happens all those Israeli woman soldiers, I'm sure. </whine>
Posts: 2409 | Registered: Sep 2003
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LOL Rakeesh. I was thinking chimney cozy. Doileys are too frilley.
Jhai - My brother was in the Marines for two years. In basic training he contracted a nasty case of cellulitis, MRSA and was diagnosed with fibromyalsia. The cellulitis literally ate a hole in his leg. This was about two thirds of the way through basic training, and it was just before the swim test, where he had to do however many laps in the pool with 40+ pounds of gear (full gear) on him. They told him he could do it with one leg, or he could start basic training all over again. He did it with one leg.
My point? I have a biological problem with military service too.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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Why are the Marines even bothering trying to recruit in Berkeley to begin with? That seems like the waste of tax dollars...
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Maybe because despite the fact that Berkeley might be full of wackos, UC Berkeley is still a good school, and people come from all over the state and the country to go there?
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Jhai: Tangential Question: if I were a single young man, and the draft had just been reinstated, could I just say I was gay (or show some pictures of me hugging a male friend, or whatever), and thus dodge the draft?
You could try Malcolm X's strategy of telling the recruiters that you hope you are drafted so that you can have the opportunity to "shoot some white crackers."
Marine Recruiter: "Hello, may I speak with Jim Davis."
My Mother: "Who's calling please."
Marine: "My name is XXXXXX. I'm with the United States Marine Corp. Jim had shown an interest in what we have to offer so I....
My Mother: "I am sorry. Jim won't be able to sign up, what with the cast and all."
Marine: "What cast?"
My Mother: "Well, the moment he even tries to sign up for the Marines, I'll break every bone in his body. So you can see, he won't be signing up anytime soon."
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by BannaOj: I admit I don't think any other school has an element named after them.
What do you think einstium was named after, if not the Albert Einstein Institute of Mathematics? And then there's rutherfordium, clearly named after Rutherford College in New Zealand. There are more, but I trust I've made my point.
But Berkley has the distinction of having two elements name after it: berkelium and californium.
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Note: My father served in the marines, and holds his time there as very special and is proud of it. I have one Nephew who plans on enlisting within two years. Still, I believe that a mother has the right to protect her children from their own valor.
Besides, how good of a marine are you going to be if you let your mother put you in traction.
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head: But Berkley has the distinction of having two elements name after it: berkelium and californium.
BZZZZ!
Californium is named after the UC system (and the state of California) in general, not just UC Berkley. Seaborg was grateful to UCLA as well.
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote:Still, I believe that a mother has the right to protect her children from their own valor.
Would you feel the same way about, for example, a mother or father using some form of coercion to get their child to enlist?
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head: But Berkley has the distinction of having two elements name after it: berkelium and californium.
BZZZZ!
Californium is named after the UC system (and the state of California) in general, not just UC Berkley. Seaborg was grateful to UCLA as well.
Rivka, if you're going to correct my post for inaccuracies, why do you choose to correct the one statement that actually has some truth in it, instead of the rest of my post, which is completely false?
Posts: 16551 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head: Rivka, if you're going to correct my post for inaccuracies, why do you choose to correct the one statement that actually has some truth in it, instead of the rest of my post, which is completely false?
1) The rest of it is so obviously false that it needs no correction. 2) I corrected the part I care about.
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote:I'm all for protecting my children from their own valor!
This isn't the part I'm questioning. The part I'm questioning is the implied belief that you and Dan_Raven are suggesting (or at least mentioning), that using coercion on an older child (like, at the 16-18 age) for their own good is a good thing or not.
My suspicion is that you find that appropriate only insofar as you agree with the cause being advocated through coercion; if a parent were to say, "If you don't enlist in the Marines, you'll be in big trouble!" I suspect you'd be horrified.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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I was just thinking the other day that when you first came here, you seemed to have no sense of humor whatsoever. Sarcasm was a mystery to you, and you'd routinely mistake jokes for literal claims, and challenge the poster.
Now it seems like half your posts are jokes, and usually are pretty funny ones at that.
Was it just the medium that took some getting used to?
Posts: 5656 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:I'm all for protecting my children from their own valor!
This isn't the part I'm questioning. The part I'm questioning is the implied belief that you and Dan_Raven are suggesting (or at least mentioning), that using coercion on an older child (like, at the 16-18 age) for their own good is a good thing or not.
My suspicion is that you find that appropriate only insofar as you agree with the cause being advocated through coercion; if a parent were to say, "If you don't enlist in the Marines, you'll be in big trouble!" I suspect you'd be horrified.
I'll agree with this. But then, my parent's have been letting me make my own mistakes and owning up to them for quite a while before 18.
Posts: 2208 | Registered: Feb 2004
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If my 20 year old told me he was off to join the Marines, I don’t know what I would do. I'd probably try to bravely hug him and wish him the best, if that would make him happy, as I always want my children to be happy. First though, I’d want major reassurance from him that this was what he truly wanted to do and that he’d thought about the decision deeply and for quite awhile. I’d also want to know why he felt like this was his calling. Sure, there would be tears, plenty of them and plenty of long conversations. I wouldn’t threaten to break his legs.
If my just turned 17 or 9 year old boys, or even my 14 year old daughter, voiced the same opinion, I’d threaten to break their legs. I’d also quote Dan’s mother to anyone that called me/them trying to recruit them. They have very important things that they need to learn and experience before they consider joining the Marines. That’s just me, being a mom, keeping them on an organized path into adulthood.
My boys are at completely different stages in their lives. They are two completely different human beings and are at different levels of maturity.
In answer to the above question, yes, I would be horrified if someone harassed their children into joining the Marines! I think that’s a very personal decision that each adult must make for themselves.
Posts: 3771 | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:In answer to the above question, yes, I would be horrified if someone harassed their children into joining the Marines! I think that’s a very personal decision that each adult must make for themselves.
I respect your decision and your thought-process, even though you do contradict yourself, at least from earlier posts. Clearly it is not the harassment you mind, it's the harassment into making what you deem the wrong decision.
In other words, it's problematic if a parent harrasses a child into that decision, but not if they harrass their child out of that decision.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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I'm all about contradicting myself Rakeesh! If you ever meet me in person, you'll wonder how I function on a daily basis without major medication!
I don't like harassment of any kind, especially harassment targeting young minds, or old minds for that matter and especially harassment into making what I deem wrong decisions.
Thank you for understanding me. You do understand me..don't you? Posts: 3771 | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:They even threw in an article about Taylor Swift to make it more appealing.
Well there's a classic case of knowing your audience. They should advertise E-Warfare, UAV operator jobs, and other geeky stuff in gaming magazines. It's an untapped, powerful resource.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:I don't like harassment of any kind, especially harassment targeting young minds, or old minds for that matter and especially harassment into making what I deem wrong decisions.
Naw, everyone has contradictions, I don't mind. I entirely understand your motivations on this issue, I think: you don't want your chilluns to get hurt. I can hardly fault you for that! Every parent should be zealous about that.
The only thing I'm trying to understand is that while you say you disapprove of harrassment, it seems you endorse and even cheer on your own (potential) harrassment if one of your 17 year old kids got it into his head to join up.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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"The only thing I'm trying to understand is that while you say you disapprove of harrassment, it seems you endorse and even cheer on your own (potential) harrassment if one of your 17 year old kids got it into his head to join up."
Yes, that's correct. My 17 year old is a junior in high school. He's got other things to concentrate on right now. It's an age thing, get it?
At least I tell myself it's an age thing. To be quite honest, that's the last thing I'd ever want my kids to be a part of. I'd volunteer to go, if someone in the family had to go. I'd much rather handle fighting for my family and country myself, than send one of my children.
However, I don't call it harrassment. I call it love.
Posts: 3771 | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:However, I don't call it harrassment. I call it love.
Of course you do, I understand that. But technically, threatening to break all of your kid's legs, which obviously isn't literal but probably means attempts at persuasion through long discussions, or even punishments or restriction of privileges (correct me if I'm wrong) is hardly a 'hands-off' approach to the issue, is it?
'Harrassing out of love' might be a better term, even though the word has negative connotations.
I'm not disagreeing with your choice to make sure your kid focuses on other things. I'm pointing out that, in fact, it's not the harrassment that bothers you (from recruiters, for example), it's harrassment in a bad direction that bothers you (because you would, from what I understand, harrass to avoid that outcome).
The only reason I'm talking about this at all is that initially, it was sort of suggested that you were against recruiters harrassing because they were trying to trick a kid into joining, unduly influencing them, etc. etc., in some way violating the kid's otherwise independant thinking.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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When someone made fun of my brother as a kid, I would get angry and scream at them. Ten minutes later, I would say something ten times worse to him. A mom gets to harrass kids, a stranger doesn't.
Posts: 1001 | Registered: Mar 2006
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I thought what Dan's mother told the recruiters was funny. I liked the way she handled the conversation.
I'm sure she would never have seriously broken his legs, as I would most likely never break my boys legs, with the exception of the 9-yr old, they're much bigger and stronger than I am, so what would be the point of even trying. Of course, I'm kidding. I'd still be able to break their legs if I really wanted to because I'm sneaky and crafty in that way.
Rakeesh, the recruiters are there for a reason. They've learned certain tricks and tactics that seem to work quite well for them. I for one don't care for them to work their magic on my boys.
I don't know how else to contradict myself. I don't think trying to talk a child that I gave birth to and love dearly out of going to war, is the same as trying to talk him into going to war or allowing him to be gently, smoothly persuaded by some charming recruiter into following a certain path. I'm not trying to discourage independent thinking. I also am apparently biased in this particular situation.
I'm obviously not the queen of words. I have a hard time expressing myself. I think you know what I mean.
Posts: 3771 | Registered: Sep 2002
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