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Alas, Shadow Puppets is the only book I brought with me from home. I'm planning to pick up a (used) copy of Prentice Alvin and either Sarah or Rebecca, or anything else I can find cheap. I'm going to a library soon, so I should pick up some others there.
Posts: 66 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Well, at the moment I will admit to reading a couple books that are not by OSC. I am just about 100 pages off of finishing the Legacy of the Drow by Salvatore, and am reading Timeline by Crichton on my Axim when I have spare moments.
I plan on getting into the Alvin Maker series next though.
Posts: 240 | Registered: Jun 2003
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Good book. I had a couple technical problems with it, though. Let me know if you notice anything . . . wrong with it.
Posts: 66 | Registered: Feb 2003
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PastWatch: The Redemption of Christopher Columbus
I'm reading it for the second time. I loved it the first time through...it's one of the best Sci-Fi novels I've ever read.
Posts: 149 | Registered: Aug 2003
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I loved Timeline -- but I'm dying with curiosity to now what technical problems you thought about when you read it. It has been awhile since I read it, but would still love to hear your viewpoint.
How familiar are you with the laws of physics pertaining to parallel universes? Because there were some serious flaws in the information he used, which is amazing because of the amount of research he does for his books. It sounded good, most of it was good, but the important stuff was not clear, thrown together, and didn't seem like he even understood them.
Basically, the characters in Timeline found the note from the Professor on the dig, then went to a different universe to save him (since time travel is impossible, one must go to a similar, parallel universe to that earlier time). How could the note, from a different but parallel universe reach them? And then Marek at the end? It's impossible.
The only answer I have is that at the same time the Professor left to a parallel universe, another Professor, from another universe, jumped into the current Earth, but in the past. Some clarification of the scientific principles he used would be great, because it would help prove this theory, otherwise, there's this major gap in the "timeline" and a flaw with his pseudo-time travel theory. I hope not, I'm so sure he's too smart to leave such major holes like this.
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My summer has been spent getting re-aquainted with OSC...I just took back COTM to the library... When I was much younger I read Wyrms...but I could not wrap my brain around all of the concepts...so when I re-read it at the beginning of summer I aquired a new respect for OSC. So I looked thru the section where I got it and started on Enders game...I made short work of it and was HUNGRY for more. SFtD wasn't at the library so I had to wait for the inter loan...So I read Enders shadow shadow of the hegemon and shadow puppets.Still waiting for the inter loan(very tiresom) I picked up on the Alvin Series and read all of the released works. I did this so I didn't poison my view of Speaker with the half information I would have from Xenocide. To make this very long story short...I'm just waiting for the next installment to the series.
Posts: 46 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Same here, bricks. I'm anxious to get my grasp on sotg, if that's what you mean by "the next installment of the series". I find it difficult - I finish books so quickly that I can't wait for the ensuing book. Like Harry Potter and OP. I finished it in three days and now I have to wait. But then again, I finished EG in 1 day (over night) and the rest within the next week). I've got to find other things to do to keep myself occupied...
"Remember, the enemy's gate is down"
Posts: 667 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Morgaine, I understand what you're saying (yes, I've read Schrodinger's Cat and all those theories, and I have a college-son who is a physics major and very interested in the concept of parrallel universes).
However, I don't think at any time in Timeline, that Crighton was saying we were working with different universes. He wrote the story from the viewpoint of time travel in this universe (so I didn't have a problem with the things that were found, etc).
Of course, we all know all the problems with the whole idea of time travel at all, when speaking logically. But I was reading Timeline to be ENTERTAINED, not as fact, so that is why I didn't have a problem with it, I guess.
He made it more believeable, I might add, than some of the "time travel" episodes there were on Star Trek <HA> (or Quantum Leap, if you are old enough to remember that show!)
I guess if I wanted reading to be absolutely factual, I would read non-fiction instead of fiction and sci-fi. Crighton does a good job of researching so well that is SOUNDS believable a factual -- but we have to remember that in the end, he is writing fiction.
quote:Orignially posted by Farmgirl However, I don't think at any time in Timeline, that Crighton was saying we were working with different universes. He wrote the story from the viewpoint of time travel in this universe (so I didn't have a problem with the things that were found, etc).
Not so. If you read carefully the chapter when they're on the plane and Gordon (I don't have the book, but that name sounds right....) is explaining the theory, he distinctly says that time travel is not possible, and that they are not travelling in time. They are going to a different, but parallel, universe where time has progressed slower, which is inevitable with an infinite amount fo similar, parallel universes.
quote:Originally posted by Farmgirl Of course, we all know all the problems with the whole idea of time travel at all, when speaking logically. But I was reading Timeline to be ENTERTAINED, not as fact, so that is why I didn't have a problem with it, I guess.
He made it more believeable, I might add, than some of the "time travel" episodes there were on Star Trek <HA> (or Quantum Leap, if you are old enough to remember that show!)
I guess if I wanted reading to be absolutely factual, I would read non-fiction instead of fiction and sci-fi. Crighton does a good job of researching so well that is SOUNDS believable a factual -- but we have to remember that in the end, he is writing fiction.
Yes, I remember Quantum Leap. One of my favourite shows, actually. If I remember correctly, there were very few serious holes in that show. A bunch of paradoxes, and questions, but nothing major to the integrity of the basic premise of the show.
The thing with Crichton is that his books are usually so well written, it's hard to tell that he's writing fiction. Heck, in Andromeda Strain, he had constant footnotes from non-existant and real sources. That's his style. So when I read his books, I expect to find no line between fiction and reality, something he usually does very well, even with obviously fictional ideas, such as Jurassic Park. Because I think of his books so seriously, I read them more carefully. This seemed like a major thing, to "forget" that they're not in the same universe, that it's a different one, therefore the eyeglasses, the note and the deal with Marek couldn't have happened.
Also, I understand that the concept of time travel is impossible. It's still a fascinating subject. If one can make it sound plausible, while not sounding too spaceship-y, great. He did, the theory was amazing about the time travel, but there's still the question of Marek and the professor, which is a major one.
As I said, I've seen only one possible way for his theory to be regarded as correct, and the plot to flow, and that is to have a simultaneous "leap" (if I may) of a different professor from a different universe into ours, at the same time that the professor from ours left to yet another one. So a diagram would look something like three parallel lines, A, B, and C (the universes) with a jump from the end of B to the middle of C. at the same time, there would also have to be a jump from the end of A to the middle of B, B being our universe, C being the one where everyone goes, and A being a similar but more advanced universe.
Meh, ok, maybe I take it too seriously, but if you're going to write Science Fiction, or at least Science-based fiction, you'd better be prepared for people to read your work critically. Especially serious fans!
Posts: 66 | Registered: Feb 2003
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It HAS been a long time since I read Timeline, so maybe I should go back and read again a little more carefully. I must have missed (or forgotten about) that passage you refer to.
However, I also agree with you -- he writes so very realistically on the scientific level, that it is often hard to remember that we are reading fiction!
I found his most recent, "Prey" to be that way -- but I know so little about the area of science he addresses in this book, I wouldn't recognize any discrepancies if there were there.
Posts: 9538 | Registered: Aug 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Farmgirl Thanks for the correction, Morgaine.
It HAS been a long time since I read Timeline, so maybe I should go back and read again a little more carefully. I must have missed (or forgotten about) that passage you refer to.
However, I also agree with you -- he writes so very realistically on the scientific level, that it is often hard to remember that we are reading fiction!
I found his most recent, "Prey" to be that way -- but I know so little about the area of science he addresses in this book, I wouldn't recognize any discrepancies if there were there.
No problem. The only reason I'm familiar with it is because I must have read the book about 15 times (almost as many as Shadow Puppets )
I haven't read Prey yet, but I plan to. It is amazing how much research he does for his books. I always wondered whether all novelists put that much care and effort into them, to make them seem plausible, or if some people just have a knack for making the impossible sound possible, or if only SciFi writers cared.
"Nothing is impossible, only improbable." - Isaac Asimov
Posts: 66 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Children of the Mind, now. I'm sort of mad, though...after I finish this one, I would have read all of the available Ender/Bean books, and I'll have to wait for SotG. I don't want to do that. :/ I would next read the Alvin Maker books, but I don't want to start another series that I couldn't finish for a while. And the other books written by OSC don't look as interesting, which means I'll probably venture on to another author. But if I do that, and get involved in another author, I may forget about Bean's series!
Agh, reading is a frustrating business. Posts: 2292 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Reading can be frustrating - I finished SP about a month ago and I'm just waiting for SOTG to be released...but imagine all of those people who read SP when it was released, about a year ago. They have to wait for an even longer amount of time. See, this part is frustrating, too!!
I am currently reading The Seventh Son , but I'm only on about page 10. I don't know why I haven't found time to get around to it. I feel terrible !! Well, I have plenty of time over the weekend I suppose. I really wish that SOTG was available for reading now, but I will certainly bump it up to the top of the list when it comes out!!
*edited because I accidentally said that SOTG had been released a year ago when I meant to say SP...
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UPDATE--I haven't posted in a while (though I've been a lurker extraordinaire) so here goes:
In the time since I originally posted this, I finished Unaccompanied Sonata and started on both The Worthing Saga and First Meetings. Both of them currently occupy the place-on-the-floor-next-to-my-bed-where-a-nightstand-would-be-if-I-actually-had-one (aside: that may have set a record for the number of hyphens in a phrase.)
Also, I have moved back to Radford, Va. because the season ended with the (musical Big River) on Aug. 23rd and I started classes at Radford University on the 25th.
Posts: 786 | Registered: Jun 2003
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I can't wait for Shadow of the Giant and The last two Alvin books! Right now I'm sort of re-reading Ender's Game (from the library, I don't own it ). I also want to read OSC's other books, but I have to get the money to buy them first . Darn bookstore only has expensive hardbacks...ARG...
I'm also reading The Book Of Merlyn by T.H. White.
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I didn't even know who OSC was until about 5 weeks ago. I started with Ender's Game and read through the shadow books, then started with Speaker and I just finished Xenocide tonight, but I didn't finish it until the bookstore had already closed, so I couldn't go get COTM
I've been reading the enderverse back to back for the past five weeks. Hi my name is Ryan, and I'm addicted to OSC!
Posts: 2 | Registered: Sep 2003
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I was sick today, and my family gave me Shadow Puppets paperback for my birthday, but I hadn't read Shadow of the Hegemon yet, so I borrowed it from my little brother and read that today. I guess Shadow Puppets is up next...
Was that even proper english? :0) Wonder Dog
Posts: 353 | Registered: Sep 2003
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I did a search and couldn't find this so I'll ask someone to explain, why is time travel impossible? Get as physics-y as you want, I'll follow.
Posts: 196 | Registered: May 2003
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Just last night I finished Shadow Puppets, and I can officially says I've read all in Ender's saga. I had just started The Worthing Saga, but when I got this book I jumped to the occaision.
After I'm done with that, any next-series suggestions?
(This is my first post on any Hatrack River forums, btw.)
Posts: 3 | Registered: Sep 2003
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Rohan Your question is best answered by Morgaine, but it has already been discussed in this thread, when we talked about Michael Crichton's book TIMELINE
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thanks, Farmgirl, but it still didn't answer the question of why time-travel is impossible. The name Schroedinger's Cat was thrown out, and the problems with the book Timeline were mentioned but none of these specifically addressed why time travel is impossible. that's ok, though. it is too much probably for this thread, and a definite derailment.
Posts: 196 | Registered: May 2003
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[u]About time travel and why it cannot happen:[/u]
(please note that I do not consider this suffiecient proof for time travel not being possible, it is a good concept nonetheless.)
According to Dean Koontz, in the wonderful novel Lightning, time travel is impossible because of the paradoxes it creates.
A person cannot go back in time, because anything he alters will not create his timeline. He would have created a tangent to the original line. (think "Back to the Future Part 2") His world, his timeline, where he came from, does not exist anymore, so neither does he. He ceases, at that moment of change, to exist.
A person cannot go foreward in time for the same reason, just reverse. If they change the future, it would mean a change in the past of the future, and his world wouldn't exist anymore. He ceases to exist as well.
Therefore, we may be able to get there, but we can't do anything. I mean anything. Breathe, take up space, because any change leads to our non-existence.
There are other, more technical, physics related answers, I can go into them another time, but right now I have to catch a bus. Hope this helps. Read the Dean Koontz for a better, clearer, explanation. (I asked the question at NASA, they verified it, so don't think it's just one novelists idea)
Posts: 66 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote: A person cannot go back in time, because anything he alters will not create his timeline. He would have created a tangent to the original line. (think "Back to the Future Part 2") His world, his timeline, where he came from, does not exist anymore, so neither does he. He ceases, at that moment of change, to exist.
I think time would freeze. Your theory works, except, if he doesn't exist, he couldn't change the past, which means the change of the past (since it wouldn't exist) couldn't possibly affect his future. So, I think time would freeze.
Still waiting on the next book in the Shadow series.
And for those of you reading Pastwatch...stick with it, it took me a while to get thru the first Half of the book(almost a month and a half) but once the characters are layed out and the plot is set, the rest is well worth the wait.
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I just finished reading Enchantment...again. I love it! *sigh* It's a great book. I really like books that take fairy tales and put a new twist on them.
Posts: 4174 | Registered: Sep 2003
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seems like the only time i can find to read is during my lunch at work. i'm about to finish neil gaiman's american gods, and i would like to find my way through the harry potter series, but as for OSC, i'm keeping up with the online preview of the crystal city, i still need to get ahold of a copy of shadow puppets, and somewhere, though i am about to move, i have a copy of saints.
Posts: 1090 | Registered: Oct 2003
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I'm currently rereading Maps in a Mirror. I love his short stories and how he can expand some of them into novels without changing the short, like EG. Some of my favorites in it are: Eye for Eye; Kingsmeat; Sandmagic; Fat Farm; and my favorite, A Thousand Deaths. I enjoy every short in the book and they are put together perfectly. I can sit down and read the whole thing in one sitting, or I can read one at a time. The book just flows.
Posts: 15 | Registered: Oct 2003
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Currently I have just finished all of the Enderverse books again, and I find that college leaves me with some spare time. My problem is that after reading many of OSC essays I find that I fear the unknown, in the aspect that I'm cautious about reading other writings by OSC, because they could leave me with a repeat distaste. So as not to obtain that impression again, I was wondering what books you would suggest that are similar to the Ender series. To put it bluntly a series without a lot of personal politics involved. Thank you for all potential suggestions. Posts: 129 | Registered: Sep 2003
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Well I would say that Earthborn is on my nightstand, but one I don't have a nightstand and two, I carry the book around with me in my car so if I get a spare 30 seconds, at a train or something, I can read. But other then that I have been so busy lately, I have been reading Earthborn for about a week now Posts: 58 | Registered: Feb 2003
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Waiting for Crystal City. Now that Walking on Water is finished and I don't have a fix every few days I'll probably reread the rest of the series just to get me back up to date.
Posts: 1294 | Registered: Oct 2003
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currently reading Crystal City (advanced proof). I was a little worried about the fact that it was available before the release date, so I wrote an email to Tor. Never received a response so I guess they don't mind.
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i FINALLY got the Crystal City-- 5 days after it came out. aggg, the abuse!!! anyway. i'm on page 232 and its pretty good so far. yay. i stayed up really late last night reading that and my damned confusing science magazines so now i'm pooped.
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Shadow Puppets, then I'm planning on rereading the Alvin series before friday, when I'll go to the signing and buy Crystal City.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
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The Investment Counselor from First Meetings. Can't get enough of the super-being Jane. Especially when they can do what she did with Ender's taxes. Posts: 129 | Registered: Sep 2003
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!! Well, I have plenty of time over the weekend I suppose. I really wish that SOTG was available for reading now, but I will certainly bump it up to the top of the list when it comes out!! ![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
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. Darn bookstore only has expensive hardbacks...ARG... ![[Grumble]](graemlins/grumble.gif)
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i stayed up really late last night reading that and my damned confusing science magazines so now i'm pooped. ![[Sleep]](graemlins/sleep.gif)
