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Time for a change. Chris doesn't like life in the Big City, so in February I moved to his neighborhood of Glen Burnie (a suburb of Baltimore) and we got an apartment together. Things have been going swimmingly.
My ex and I decided to sell our joint property in Baltimore (for a pretty decent profit) and with my share of the extra cash I've been looking for a nice place to move into. Chris and I had been thinking of looking in the Hanover, PA area, since we have friends there and it's about the same commute to work (just from the opposite direction). Anyway, we saw and fell in love with this house , and put in a contract on it. We just had the home inspection done this weekend, and there is a lot of work to do on it, but most of that I was aware of on first walkthrough.
The stuff that needs fixing is fairly extensive. It needs a new roof very soon, and both the front and back porches need work (actually, the back porch needs to be replaced - not critically, but I wouldn't have a party on it). There will be some need to upgrade parts of the electical system, but the current owner runs a beauty parlor in the first floor of the house so clearly it can handle quite an electric and plumbing load.
The cool things about the house:
- It's HUGE. 2661 sq. ft. 10 rooms, full (unfinished) basement. - Nice L-shaped front porch. - Turret (I've always wanted a house with a turret). - Large (by my standards) back yard. - All orignal wood trim and moldings in oak and chestnut in excellent condition (never been painted). - Hardwood floors in fairly good shape. - Original plaster walls and ceiling in good shape (some settling cracks but otherwise firm) with some exceptions where I'll have to drywall.
Things that will need work:
- The back porch (both levels) will need to be replaced. This isn't so bad because I plan to have it rebuilt strong enough to support a hot tub on the upper level. - The kitchen is on the 2nd floor (used to be a bedroom). Again this isn't so bad because I'll have a kitchen to use while I reconvert one of the 1st floor rooms to a kitchen. - The roof needs to be replaced. Right now it is a patchwork. 3/4 asphalt shingle, 1/4 slate tile, and a couple of sections of metal roof (badly corroded). This will probably be one of my biggest expenses as I plan to replace the whole thing with either standing-seam metal, or an architectural tile (made from recycled tires, formed to look like slate from the street), both pretty much guaranteed for 50 years. - I'll want to add a garage at the back of the property. Right now there is parking there, but it is open and is just a worn spot on the lawn.
The town is small and quiet, so when we want nightlife, we'll be driving 45 minutes or so to Baltimore, or Harrisburg. But the people are very friendly and from what I've been able to experience so far, pretty tolerant of alternative lifestyles.
Chris is excited too, as I don't think he's ever even dreamed of living in a house like this. We're already talking about how we'll decorate for Christmas and Halloween and what kinds of parties we'll have in the backyard.
Anyway, I just wanted to post this 'cause I'm so excited about it. Anyone here have any experience restoring an old house?
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It looks beautiful. I really like turrets, too. I hope you're getting a great price, and I hope you have lots of free time Posts: 1892 | Registered: Mar 2002
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Good for you, KarlEd! I am happy for you both, and i hope the town is as tolerant as it seems.
I take it your friends are happy with the town, too?
I use to live in Frederick, MD when I was in the service, and I really love that area. I like winter but it lasts too damn long up here. In MD the winters were only 2 1/2 months long, usually.
Harpers Ferry is a very cool town to visit...I got my favorite tee-shirt there, but it is falling apart now... . It's quite a beautiful area, and it was one of the places I considered moving back to before we decided on Florida.
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That place is beautiful. You could have some great Halloween parties there.
I've always wanted to live in a house with a turret too.
Kwea, do you live in FL now?
quote:Unfortunately, I know nothing about home restoration
You learn as you go on a lot of it. I know an enormous amount more now than I did 5 years ago when I moved into a 20-yr old house that had a very cheap previous owner.
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Suneun, I'm getting a very good price by the local standards and an absolutely FANTASTIC price by Baltimore standards.
Kwea, I've run into two other gay people just by chance on two consecutive weekend visits and they both said they have never felt unwelcome in the town. Part of this, I think, is a sign of general societal acceptance of gays, and part of this is because the town is growing from the influx of ex-Balto-Washingtonians looking for affordable housing.
PA, though only 3-45 minutes North of Baltimore, is practically a different climate. PA gets snow in most of the storms that just drop freezing rain on Baltimore. (Given a choice, I prefer the snow.) Harper's Ferry is a great place to visit. Very photogenic.
Rakeesh, unfortunately I ALREADY commute 45 minutes one-way. This house is only a few miles farther away than where I live now, but since the commute is back-roads rather than the stand-still beltway traffic, the commute is about the same.
zgator, yeah, I'll probably have a Halloween party this year. The great thing about those is that I won't even have to have fixed anything in the house for it to be presentable at Halloween. Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Lovely, lovely house. I bought a house 5 years ago that was bulit in 1918, and have been slowly remodeling. Lots of fun. Only advise I have I'm sure you already know... everything will end up more complicated and more expensive than you think it's going to be.
Posts: 7954 | Registered: Mar 2004
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Oooooo . . . Hardwood floors and a turret! It looks like it will be beautiful.
ElJay has been restoring her old house on and off for the last few years, including restoring the hardwood floors. I'll make sure she looks in this thread.
First, I LOVE the house -- older Victorian houses are my absolute favorite -- and I should know because mine is, as well.
But let me warn you, they ARE a money pit. In other words, besides what you see that you need to fix up that you mention above, these beautiful older homes need continual work. Just be warned and be ready.
I'm willing to do it because I love my house so much (and it's paid for) -- but there are always times I think it would be cheaper to tear down and start over.
Don't know how much previous owners have upgraded this one, but let's hope quite a bit. My own home was built originally in 1880, and has not had all the upgrades it needs. Due to that, it is almost impossible to get insurance on it. Hopefully in this house you are looking at, all the wiring has been updated.
Old plaster and lathe is good, but you mentioned replacing it in a couple areas, and this is really tedious, dirty work. I hope you have done it before.
I wish you the best -- these older homes are jewels that should be preserved. I hope you will share photos as you progress with your work on it.
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By the way, KarlEd, -- what kind of heating/ventilation system is in it? Have you already figured how much utilities and insurance are going to run you on such a large house?
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Way cool! Sad about the big tree being half dead, though. You'll want to get that taken care of before you build the new porch.
My house was built in 1900 out of rough sawn wood from the property, just a basic square farmhouse with an addition in 1910. It's very fun to work on as long as there is water and the bathroom fixture plumbing works well.
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I don't know what the utilities will cost. The heating is a gas furnace/boiler and radiator system and it passed the inspection with no problem. The electric system does need some upgrading, (there was some illegal wiring that the current owner has to fix prior to settlement) but the home inspection was VERY thorough and the house passed nearly everything else.
I've done plaster demolition prior to drywall work before. I know it is very very dusty work and nearly impossible to keep the dust from every corner of the house.
I plan to document the progress on my website (linked above). I'm very interested in fixing up the house and staying true to the original design, but I'm not exactly a purist. (For example, where the plaster isn't repairable, I'll be replacing with drywall.) As long as the spirit of the house is kept, I don't mind a little updating.
As for decorating, I'm a pretty eclectic guy and probably won't be decorating in a strictly Victorian style. I do want the first floor to be fairly elegant, but some of the upper rooms will be more contemporary. The garden in the back (which the photos don't show at all, really) is simple but very full of flowers. I'll probaby be doing some major changes to it. For the front, you can see that the bushes are terribly over-grown. I think they are too big to cut back as it looks like all the green growing parts are already above where I'd idealy cut them back to. What I plan to try is to remove most of the under growth to expose the trunk structure and thin the top. I envision this giving the illusion of a solid band of green supported by twisty brown arms. If that doesn't work, they will probably come out, though I hate to just rip out a healthy plant.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Yeah, the photo used for the real estate listing shows that tree in full leaf. The current owner said that it was struck by lightening this spring just as it was budding out. You can't see it well in the photo, but a large portion of the "dead" area has tiny green leaves trying to come out. I'm going to have a tree specialist take a look at it and tell me my options. The dead stuff will have to come out, of course, but I'm hoping more of it survives than the photo seems to imply. Of course, if that tree has to come out, there is no way I'll have another like it in my lifetime. Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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quote: The electric system does need some upgrading, (there was some illegal wiring that the current owner has to fix prior to settlement)
Just curious, but was that required or was that something you negotiated that they fix. We just sold our house and there was some wiring that didn't meet current codes. The inspector said it wasn't required that it be fixed, though. None of it was considered dangerous, though.
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Good Luck, man. I too live in PA but the Northwestern corner between Erie and Pittsburgh. Remember, You've Always Got A Friend In Pennsylvania!
Posts: 1870 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote: - All orignal wood trim and moldings in oak and chestnut in excellent condition (never been painted).
You know -- you are SO LUCKY for that little tidbit. My grandmother went through and PAINTED all the woodwork in our house many many years ago. I could just cry. I know I can strip it and get it back to original wood, but it is going to be hard and tedious... and I'm afraid of damaging it while taking it off....
Farmgirl
p.s. -- I hope you can post some photos of the inside soon, as well.
Posts: 9538 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Well, technically we're in negotiations to have that fixed. The inspection found some bare wiring in the attic (what he called a "western union" connection) which is illegal and unsafe, and the main junction box ironically appears to be an upgrade (it is circuit-breakers rather than fuses - which are in junction boxes on the second and third floors), but there is no main disconnect for power to the house, which is also illegal.
We have a negotiated sale price already which I think is very fair. Because these are safety issues I have the right to demand they be fixed or I am released from the sale contract. However, since these things have been discovered in an official inspection, the home owner and her realtor are required to disclose this information to any future buyers up front. This means new buyers are likely to require they be fixed, or lower the price even further. So it is in her best interest to fix them for me. I could swallow the cost and do it myself after settlement, but the realtor advises that unless these things are fixed, the house might not meet the bank's appraisal requirements or I might find it hard to get insurance (both of which have to happen before the house is officially MINE). So I've made an addendum to the sale contract. If the owner refuses, I guess we'll play it by ear. I can't imagine that she would, though. (But you never know).
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Farmgirl, I'll post some photos as soon as the house is mine. I felt funny about taking photos while the original owner's stuff is still in it. I'm trying to be sensitive because I'm really happy about owning the house, and the original owner is near tears about selling it. She's elderly and is going to live with her daughter, and she has cancer (though I don't know all the details on that.)
I asked her about some history on the house and the next time I saw her she wrote me a letter telling me a little about each owner, (and a pretty interesting story about one of them) and expressing how she is glad that the house will go to someone who seems to love it as much as she does. She has had several people look at the house and some of them walked through it talking about how they were going to rip out this and convert that (and one even talked about painting the molding!!) to the point that she's made a point to not be around when the house is shown.
I agree about the molding. Most of the old houses in Baltimore have had the moldings painted and it is pretty much impossible to restore them. You can remove most of the paint and you can sand for days, but if there is any detail in the moldings at all you'll never get it all out without a dozen different tools and painstaking hours of picking in the cracks. Believe me, I've tried.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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quote:I asked her about some history on the house and the next time I saw her she wrote me a letter telling me a little about each owner, (and a pretty interesting story about one of them)
How wonderful! I was going to ask if you knew much of the history of the house. This is great!
I have one room in my house (the front room you walk into when you enter the front door) that when I'm done remodeling it, I plan to decorate the walls solely with photos of the house from over the years. I think the earliest I have of it is a very old photo from around the turn of the century. I would like to get all these enlarged and framed and let the walls tell the "story" of the history of the house, of the farm, and of the family. The way I envision it is very cool -- hope I can make it come to fruition.
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But of my houses were built in 1957. While I dream of someday owning a graceful Victorian house, my husband dreams of building a straw bale house. So our new dream is to have the straw bale house in a southern desert, and the Victorian house in some northern mountain town.
I hope it works out for you, Karl Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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I've talked to so many people who've said that they love Victorian style architecture. They really can't be any more expensive to build than the cookie-cutter variety houses I see being built in every un-planted farmer's field from Washington DC to New York City. Why is it that no one is building Victorian-style houses these days?
I realize that people buy what they can afford and what's available, but I'm talking about these developments where they build 3 sorta-different style homes as "models" then build to order on vacant lots in the development based on the models. I bet if enough new home owners said, "I love this location, but I'd really rather find a Victorian-style house" a few of these developers would come up with some Victorian-style "models".
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KarlEd -- I've found a few (very few) Victorian-style new homes in the midwest. Those that I can think of are in the country. I guess the main reasons are:
1) in urban areas, homes in a platted "development" tend to all look somewhat similiar in order to appease the covenants and the blending of the development community.
2) Victorian style homes are usually very large, and sometimes the design isn't the best use of space, so some architects just shy away from the idea.
At least that's my opinion. But I could send you a photo of a very very lovely Victorian new home about 9 miles from me.
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S'okay, I'm trying to settle by the 20th of August, move in by the 28th, and I've decided I'm going to have a party within two weeks of moving in regardless of the condition of packing/unpacking, etc.
That puts the housewarming hopefully labor-day weekend, or perhaps the following weekend. All you Jatraqueros are invited. Email me privately if you'd like to come.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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zgator: No, Jenni and I are planning to move there this winter if we can afford to then.
KarlEd: Good for you two! I love that area, as i said, and I hope it works out for you.
Alucard: Where in PA are you? I was born in Allegany County Hospital...and my family is fromm Bridgeville and Brookline PA....
Posts: 15082 | Registered: Jul 2001
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KarlEd, i second Kwea's question. I'm in PA. Bethlehem area. There's a Hanover right around here, but there's also a few others scattered around PA as well. Unless I read it wrong above and you were just looking for a house in the Hanover area and ended up finding it somewhere else.
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There are some new Victorian developments down in Provo. They are fairly nice, but there is something eerie, kind of Truman Show-esue about a brand spanking new Victorian house. I think mature trees would definitely help. And I'd be willing to have a new house as my Victorian house.
Victorian houses tend to be narrow and tall as part of their charm. Since houses are appraised on square footage and not overall capacity, this makes them more expensive per square foot.
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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It's lovely! Oh wow - I love the red brick! And the turret is the best. What are you going to put in that upper turret room?
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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Congratulations on the new house, Karl! It looks great!!
slacker and I are getting all excited about buying our first house, which should be ready for us to move in in September or October. I'm sure being a home owner will be a fun new adventure for me. Got any good tips? Posts: 5879 | Registered: Apr 2001
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Really Karl, that's AWESOME. It's a beautiful house and it looks like it'll be a blast. Especially your garden!! Fun!
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Sounds like it will be quite a bit of hard work but worth it at the end. I'll add my voice to the jealous chorus - a turret?! Hmmph.
Posts: 4393 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Kat - The upper turret room will be the master bedroom. The turret area itself in that room will probaby be a sitting area until Christmas when we'll have two trees, one on each level in the turret.
ludosti - it sounds like you're having a place built. Is this right? If so, I don't really have that many tips other than to keep up and all the basic maintenance. Unless you are sure this is the house you'll retire in, taking good care of it is paramount for resale. Also, if this is a stepping-stone house (one you plan to live in for 5-6 years and then sell and move into something better) make any alterations with a mind toward resale value. Don't put more into the house than you think you can get out of it. In other words, don't make improments that belong in a half-million dollar home if you can't reasonably expect to get more than 300k out of it at resale.
If I'm wrong and you aren't building new, be sure to take care of improvements ASAP. It's really sad when people put off improvements when they could be enjoying them.
I, on the other hand, feel like this house I'm buying will be where I retire. (who knows what will happen in the next 20 years, but that's my plan now) so I don't mind putting in the best kitchen I can afford and building a superiour deck and such because I'm doing it for me and not for possible re-sale.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Yes, this is a new build, stepping-stone house. Several of the options we chose, we chose thinking about the added value at resale. One nice thing is that, although the house isn't even finished yet, it's already gone up in value (comparing our price to the current price of that model) by more than $10k.
Thanks for the advice about keeping up on the maintenance. I will need to keep that in mind.
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Keeping up on the maintenance serves two purposes if you are going to re-sell. First the house will be in good condition when you go to sell. Second, and perhaps more importantly, you will be enjoying the good condition of the house while you live there. I had friends who decided to move, but in order to get best price for their house they finished a portion of the basement they had been putting off, painted, and did several minor improvements. By the time they were done the house looked like new and they remarked several times that they should have done those things years ago and enjoyed them while they were living in the house. That stuck with me. Do for yourself all the things you think should be done to sell the place and you'll enjoy your time in the house that much more.
Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Well, I went to settlement to sell my Baltimore property. This Friday is settlement on the house in Hanover. I can't wait. Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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How wonderful! Do let me know how the tree is doing.
My husband and I did tons of remodeling when we were first married. Let me forewarn you - it really can test your love for each other. Of course, he and I came out so much for the better that now we are taking on building our own house from scratch. Just make sure to continue to work on your relationship as you work on the house. It will bring out a lot of different pieces of you as you work on it. For instance, does he cuss when he is frustrated? Do you give up? Does it make it worse or better to stick with the project, or do you need to step away until you settle down? Are your decorating ideas compatible, or do you have to make compromises? All these fun issues come boiling to the surface, and usually when there are deadlines involved!
In my case, my hubby is an engineer who wants to do things Practically and Efficiently. I want things to be Aesthetic and Spiritual. So we have terrific fights. But eventually we come to a compromise that works as a perfect blend of both of us. May you and Chris have the same powerful experience!
May your home be filled with light, love, and laughter.
Posts: 3141 | Registered: Apr 2000
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Thanks Jenny. I think in our case it will be "how much will Chris's X-men memorabilia insinuate itself into the decor." He's got a lot and I don't want him to feel like it's gotta be locked out of sight or anything. I just don't want an X-men welcome mat or X-men curtains in the dining room. Posts: 6394 | Registered: Dec 1999
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Congratulations, KarlEd! As an HGtv junkie, I look forward to following your progress.
I'm really lucky in my decorating because as long as there are places for the t.v. and computers, Andrew could care less how I decorate.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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I hope the closing goes well, and i am sure you will love the house.
JenniK, my wife, is a Disney freak, so what I plan on doing, if we have the room, is to let her have a complete room that she can put all her stuff in, as long as it isn't all over the house. It might be a spare bedroom, or a reading room, or even the family room providing we have a more formal living room as well.
That way she won't feel that I am trying to get her to kick the Disney habit (like that will ever happen...HA!), but I don't have to have Dopey and Co. scattered all over our house.
Looks like you have plenty of room in your new house to do the same if you want to....unless you prefer the X-Men shower curtins....
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. It's quite a beautiful area, and it was one of the places I considered moving back to before we decided on Florida.![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Just make sure to continue to work on your relationship as you work on the house. It will bring out a lot of different pieces of you as you work on it. For instance, does he cuss when he is frustrated? Do you give up? Does it make it worse or better to stick with the project, or do you need to step away until you settle down? Are your decorating ideas compatible, or do you have to make compromises? All these fun issues come boiling to the surface, and usually when there are deadlines involved! 
