posted
We'd just take it and install it on a job or something. And if we were contacted about it, we'd say "Well, you gave us the option to have it taken away, and we chose not to. We decided to keep it instead. Thanks for the gift."
Jenny, you don't want it shipped, you can buy one local cheaper than you can afford the shipping.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
Uh, yeah. That is way out of line. I'm glad to hear it's not sanctioned by the national office.
Posts: 1021 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
Your husband is likely to get written about in a campus newspaper for being a fuddy-duddy, though.
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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You are inconveniencing someone for money. It's a mild form of extortion, which is at the very least rude.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
Farmgirl, what if I did the same thing for, say, abortion rights, teaching under-privileged Satanists or...I dunno...insert an absurd cause here you don't like and wouldn't support.
Whether or not you support the cause in question doesn't change the fact that the donation tactic is invasive and crosses the line from aggressive to criminal - specifically, littering, trespassing, dumping (depending on the criminal code) and one or two other infractions.
And here's hoping you don't get slapped with fines from your local Housing Authority or Home Owner's Association for a variety of offenses.
The pink flamingos I would think cute - a toilet bowl, not so much.
And let's not even talk about possible property damage from the trespass and littering/dumping...
posted
I don't like it being assumed that I want to donate to this charity. As was just mentioned, what if it was one I didn't support?
What if my charity dollars are very slim (and they are) and I don't want to spend even 10 dollars of it on a charity that is not one I'd normally support?
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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quote: And here's hoping you don't get slapped with fines from your local Housing Authority or Home Owner's Association for a variety of offenses.
Well - I have never participated in this particular type of thing, even though I'm familiar with it and thought it was funny. I was never on the committee that did it.
Anyway - I'm talking about towns so small they don't even think about having "departments" such as you mention above.
I'm not sure how they are "inconvenienced" - I mean - the homeowner doesn't have to touch it or anything. If they want it off their ground, their donation moves it.
Now, I could see a problem if a small donation really wasn't possible...
posted
In a small town where everybody literally knows everybody else, maybe.
At the very least, you know who not to play the joke on.
But it's an inconvience at the very least because now I either have to look at this absurd toilet or I have to call the agency in question and fork over money to have it removed. All because you think I should donate money to your cause.
Aside: You in the generic sense, not you specifically.
posted
Farmgirl, the way they did it - skulking around my house late at night, getting my dogs riled up, waking up Andrew, and scaring me - was wrong. There are 19 registered sex offenders in the area, in addition to the high crime level. For all we knew, they were home invaders. If it's not wrong, why not do it during the day?
Also, I think it's wrong to force people to donate money to any organization. Andrew and I are paying for fertility treatments and we don't have any extra charity dollars. We give to specific charities (Cystic Fibrosis Foundation and Love, Jen - a cancer research fund started in memory of a friend of mine who died from cancer) for specific reasons. Nowhere in their letter did they state that they would remove the toilet without a donation.
Also, there are a lot of animals in the area. We've had a lot of problems with skunks and racoons. What if they decided to investigate the toilet?
Lastly, I have OCD and there is a toilet on my lawn.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
This is, definitely, one of the most ridiculous forms of solicitation I've ever heard of. I grew up in a small town, but our schools certainly never put toilets on people's lawns...or anything bigger than a flyer (flier sp?) for that matter. And there would be complaints about the flyers too.
As a homeowner now, I would seriously resent the presence of unsightly items on my lawn that I did not put there. It is an invasion of privacy and property. I get furious about ads stuck on my car window and junk mail in my mailbox, so a toilet would send me right over the top. And let's not even get on the topic of spam.
But beyond all that, is the fact that it frightened the people in the house to the extent that they went for their gun. When I was young, single and living alone, every noise frightened me. I would have been furious to find out the source of my panic was some idiot dropping a toilet on my lawn.
And let's just suppose someone HAD been shot and wounded or even killed during this fiasco... Mrs. M and family would have to live with that for the rest of their lives. And even if the donation seekers brought it upon themselves by tresspassing, I'm certain that would not reduce the guilt one iota.
If you want a donation for your charity, advertise on tv, on billboards, on the radio, and let people come to you. Don't call, mail, email, or otherwise disturb my privacy.
And absolutely, positively, do not drop a toilet on my lawn. I'm older and less easily frightened now. And I own a chakram.
posted
I just got off the phone with the executive director. She was extremely nice and very apologetic and is going to call the contact person and have it removed. She was very upset about the whole situation and feels that it reflects poorly on H4H. I told her that I don't hold her or the national organization responsible and we laughed about it. Imagine coming back from lunch and having a message on your desk saying, "Please call Kira Marx re. toilet on her lawn."
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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The H4H exec. director called the Hollins contact and asked that they remove it. They came and rang our doorbell to speak with us, which I appreciated. We very calmly explained why we were upset and they gave us a pretty insincere apology. They didn't seem to care that they had made me feel unsafe in my own home or that they had woken us up. They informed us that they had permission from the VP and campus security. They also informed us that they would be continuing with the "fundraiser."
I think their "apology" annoyed me almost as much as the deed itself. They obviously didn't mean it and weren't even trying to see things from our point of view. One of the girls also insisted that they said in the letter that they would remove the toilet free of charge. When I got the letter and showed them that it said no such thing, they said they felt it was implied. Andrew and I suggested that they state that explicitly, rather than imply it. I nicely refrained from pointing out the grammatical mistakes in the letter.
I also called campus security because I had a hard time believing that they gave girls permission to skulk about people's houses late at night. They did know about the project, but they had no idea that it would be carried out so late. That makes me feel a lot better about campus security.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
If you want to be nasty about it, correct the letter in red along with the observation that at no point does the letter imply or state the toilet will be removed at no cost to the home owner upon the home owner's request.
And then send the letter to the National Office with your compliments as well as an observation concerning their representatives and their behavior when correcting a potentially criminal act.
posted
kq, the local chapter told me that they have no affiliation with the Hollins branch and the girls told me the same thing. I don't think I'm going to call again, because there really isn't anything they can do and I don't want to bother them.
You know, if my actions had made someone feel unsafe in their home, I would be genuinely sorry, even if that had not been my intention.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
:/ I agree, I hate insincere apologies. They really don't make anything better. If you're going to fake it, fake it well at least.
Posts: 4816 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
If I were you, I would still take it to the National level. And I would do the correcting the letter and sending a copy of it back with a scathing reply.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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quote: One of the girls also insisted that they said in the letter that they would remove the toilet free of charge. When I got the letter and showed them that it said no such thing, they said they felt it was implied.
It's sad that the girl got all huffy about the letter during the insincere apology, but didn't even know what it said.
Posts: 6316 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Farmgirl, I have to disagree with your viewpoint on this one.
quote:I'm not sure how they are "inconvenienced" - I mean - the homeowner doesn't have to touch it or anything. If they want it off their ground, their donation moves it.
I would not donate to an organization that solicited me in this way.
As stated above, by me and so many others, it is in poor taste.
Posts: 5771 | Registered: Nov 2000
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posted
Mrs. M, I would still send a letter - thank the executive director for calling you and helping to straighten things out, but also express your dissatisfaction with the way the local group handled it and remind them that they may want to keep a better control over what is done in their name in the future.
I'm sorry you went through with it - I'd be mad too.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
I think I read this story in an *excellent* book called "Zen and the Art of Fatherhood" or something like that.
The author and his wife are shopping in a furniture store with their as-of-yet-not-quite-pottytrained-toddler. They are distracted for a moment, and later hear their child declare triumphantly, "I did it!"
He did alright. There in the demonstration bathroom in the demonstration toilet he proudly showed his poopoo.
IIRC, they closed the lid of the comode and briskly left the building!
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Hm. This whole story is amazing to me because:
Didn't two girls get the pants sued off of them because they left a plate of COOKIES on someone's porch at the inSANEly late hour of 10pm? And didn't the lady say that she was emotionally shaken up or something?
If that lawsuit can be won (and it was), then how can anyone expect Mrs. M to be ok with people skulking around her house even later than that to put a TOILET on her lawn? Jeez! The very fact that you were scared enough to get your gun shows that it was not at a good time, and extremely unacceptable.
posted
I'm completely with Adam on calling H4H and I'm glad to see that you've already done so by the time I finally got to this thread.
And Jaiden That's one I would TOTALLY be willing to participate in... assuming I had snow... this winter was pretty bleak in comparison to our normals.
posted
Well, if shock of seeing the toilet put Mrs. M in the hospital, then yeah, I'd say she'd win hands down. Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
JenniK is involved in an orginization for girls, and I guess they did something like this, pnly with the pink flamingos, as a fundraiser...but with one huge differnce. They only did it to people they knew well, and the people were all in on it.
All the same, when Jenni told me about it I was not happy about it, and had it happened to me I would have trown them all out....that way they would have been out the money paid for them, and would not have been able to do it to anyone else.
posted
I probably will send a letter to the local chapter. If I were them, I'd be doing all that I could to either censure or disband this chapter. I still don't understand how this thing is run - the local chapter didn't even know that there was a Hollins organization and the girls informed us that they have nothing to do with the local chapter. Okay. What's the point of having a national organization if the chapters aren't going to work together?
I forgot to tell y'all - the girls said that it's been their most successful fundraiser ever and that they already raised $60. I'm shocked that people are giving them money and I'm also shocked that $60 is their most successful fundraiser ever. If I had a bake sale in HS or college that raised less than $100, I'd consider it a failure. These girls all have access to kitchens - why not do something that brings people pleasure, instead of frightening and alienating them? Or sell bottled water. Anything. Our Dan_raven works with school fundraisers, I'm sure he could tell them about many things that would net more than $60.
BTW, I did think of the cookie girls and I have more sympathy with the lady, though I would only have wanted an apology in her case.
To go even further, because I'm feeling kind of hormonal - I could be pregnant right now (we'll know Saturday). If I am, it's a high risk pregnancy and I don't need any late-night scares. What if I had been in bed and gotten up and tripped because it was dark or because the dogs were running around at my feet? It's not that far-fetched and part of being a responsible member of society is thinking about how your actions might affect others.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
I agree with you on that. (See my posts about how I would not have brought a sick baby to WenchCon had I known there would be a pregnant woman there.) It was completely irresponsible of them not to think of the fact that people might be in different places in their lives than they are. Pranking faculty and their families is very different from pranking their friends.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
Ya know when I first started reading this thread, I kinda agreed it was annoying. Though not extortion since the "threat" hasta be a joke when a toilet costs so much more than the "payoff". Kinda like sending someone a $100 with the threat that ya won't take it back unless they send ya a $1
And since I don't come from Farmgirl's neck of the woods -- which, given her and her friends&acquaintances reaction to the same situation, I very sincerely think must be a very pleasant place filled with very nice people -- it mighta taken a minute for me to start laughing at myself for being annoyed. (Whoever came up with the fundraising suggestion probably came from an equally nice neighborhood.) Though if I lived in campus housing, it'd probably have only taken a second or so before I & "dumb college pranks".
Then I'd make the "insurance" payout with a note promising more for a special delivery. I mean anybody who'd live with a HOA would hafta enjoy shelling out cash for being screwed around with. (Don't worry, Dagonee, I'd pay off any fine. Unlike neo"conservative"s, I don't give gifts billed to the recipient's credit card.)
"I got my gun and..."
HOWEVER, it is disturbing to know that college students on a college campus are in danger of being killed for immaturity by someone who pulls out a concealable weapon, a handgun because an outdoor noise is a terrorizing experience. And am wondering whether the campus police would find that to be a threat to campus security.
quote: HOWEVER, it is disturbing to know that college students on a college campus are in danger of being killed for immaturity by someone who pulls out a concealable weapon, a handgun because an outdoor noise is a terrorizing experience
hold on a sec there - how is threatening anyone made different by the fact that it's a college campus? And if your level of immaturity is such that you're stupid enough to try a stunt that involves prowling late at night, then you should be willing to face the consequences. Mrs. M stated that there are listed sex offenders in the area. People get assaulted on college campuses just like they do anywhere else. Ignorance and immaturity are no exuse for idiotic behaviour. And becuase you live on a college campus, does that mean you have to relax your standards of safety? I think not. If that had been my house, they'd have had a warning shot across their bow and then I would have let the dog after them.
Posts: 262 | Registered: Jun 2004
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It is an invasion of privacy and property. I get furious about ads stuck on my car window and junk mail in my mailbox, so a toilet would send me right over the top. And let's not even get on the topic of spam. ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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That's one I would TOTALLY be willing to participate in... assuming I had snow... this winter was pretty bleak in comparison to our normals.![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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"dumb college pranks". 
