Have you talked with your doctor about your concerns? My OB was wonderful and listened to everything I was concerned about. I agree about the birth plan.
Re: Epidurals...I didn't have one with my 12 year old son and was fearful of them. With my 2 year old daughter, it became very clear far into labor that I wasn't going to make it without one. My girl friend/coach tried to talk me out of it at the time -- she knew how I felt about them -- but I was in enough pain with no end in sight that it made sense. It was no big deal.
Re: Needles and everything else. Remember, this is for a very short period of time. I had a *wonderful*, incredible, fantastic birth experience with my son and had every anticipation that birthing my daughter would be similar. It wasn't. Health issues made the birth more complicated than I would have otherwise chosen. It ended up just being one day out of many in my life -- significant for the event, and not ruined despite unmet expectations. Try to work through your concerns, set them aside in your mind, and be willing to take the experience as it is. Definitely defend your preferences, but try to be willing to roll with it if your preferences will risk your life or the life of your baby -- that was an issue in my case, though I didn't know it at the time. (That sounds stupid now that I've written it...of course you and your baby's health will come first.)
I didn't know you were pregnant, but now that I do, I'm so happy for you! You must be blooming beautifully! Posts: 5948 | Registered: Jun 2001
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Here's the best I can do to soothe you - I've had three hospital births, and all went very well. I also was very, very glad I was in the hospital with #1 because there were complications, and only the quick thinking and quick action of my doctor saved her life, I truly believe.
First, do any of the doctors approved by insurance have nurse midwives that work under them? If so, maybe they can oversee your pregnancy and delivery and it will be much more like what you have experienced before.
Number 2, before you do anything else, make an appointment with the doctor you are going to use and talk to him, in his office, with hubby there. That gives you a lot more power - to be facing him fully clothed, as an equal. When we're vulnerable in the exam room, we tend to let the doctor control the situation.
Explain to him (or her not trying to imply all doctors are male ) why you feel the way you do and how you want things to go. The IV may be optional. I don't know, but it well might be. The drugs are most certainly optional - you must give your consent before any drugs are administered and if you don't want an epidural, no one can force you to get one.
As for them being able to start an IV in an emergency, that's not really all that true, dear. Sorry - but most nurses aren't as experienced with starting IV's under emergency circumstances as you'd like to think. And, in an emergency, if your blood pressure is falling, and/or you're under a lot of stress and in a lot of pain, they are much, much harder to start.
Consider this - 90% of all emergencies that come into a hospital already have IV's started. The paramedics do it. Even most ER nurses don't start IV's under emergency circumstances. In cases where there are emergencies, my husband as a paramedic has been asked by the ER staff to start the IVs for them - because he was much, much more experienced getting an IV under difficult circumstances.
My sister-in-law felt the same way you did. She didn't want an IV, but the doctor insisted. So, she allowed them to put in the port, but she didn't allow them to hook her up to fluids. So the port was there in case of an emergency, but she wasn't tethered to anything.
The episiotomy - this is something you can discuss with your doctor. I had one with number 1 because hers was an emergency birth - the doctor yanked her out before she was ready, in order to try and prevent an emergency cesaerean. With #2, I didn't have one at all. Since this is your second birth - you may well not have one either. I didn't need one with Daniel, but after he was born, Abigail had to be turned, (she was breech) so I wound up having a small one then too, but it was no big deal at all.
I guess what I'm trying to say is - you do have rights and the ability to affect your own birthing experience. You can tell them what you want, and they will do their best to accomodate you. Doctors don't go into the profession, usually, hating people and not wanting to please them. Especially obstetrics.
If you find the right doctor - like the one I had, you can get a working relationship you're comfortable with. For example - my doctor met me at the hospital and never left me, and informed the nursing staff that no one was to check me except him. I had twins, which are normally an automatic cesaerean. One of the twins was breech - another call for an automatic cesearean. Yet my doctor delivered both vaginally, because he cared about me and didn't want me to go home with four children recovering from a c-section. There was a long line of people who wanted to be in the OR to watch it - they had never seen a vaginal birth of twins with one breech. Of course, Ted was in charge, and told them they couldn't crowd around and disturb his patient. He also broke the rules about no jewelry in the OR, and let me wear my cross necklace that had been a gift of my husband's. And, it's hospital protocol that twins go to the NICU to be checked out after birth, Ted told the pediatric team what they could do with hospital protocol, because both babies were perfectly healthy and so they stayed with me and never went to the NICU.
Granted, a doctor like Ted may be hard to find, but they're out there. Find someone who will work with you, and you'll feel much better about the whole thing, I promise.
(((Jenny))))
And, I do want to put in a plug for modern obstetrics - I think Natalie could well have died without me being in the hospital with a good doctor. Emily, I could have had at home, it was an uncomplicatd birth. With the twins - had I been pregnant with them 100 years go I have no doubt I would have died in childbirth. Daniel could have been delivered safely, but Abigail turned transverse, and would never have been delivered.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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So much good advice on this thread. What a wonderful resource. I'd echo what has already been mentioned about interviewing physicians (clothed and with support by your side, if possible), looking for nurse midwives, arranging for someone familiar with the birthing process to be with you (an experienced friend, doula, what have you: someone disengaged enough to do piddly uninvolved things, but engaged enough to care and advocate for you -- it may be useful to have someone along with your husband, as if things get crazy he may be dealing as much with his own stress as yours).
Before we puzzle through specifics, I wanted to talk a little bit about why medical professionals may have different prioriteis than patients, and why some professionals will have different concerns than others. This is not to say that you should adapt yourself to make anyone else happy or comfortable; rather, just more information to help you put comments in perspective and make the best-informed decision.
At the hospital I worked at, I'd guess we covered 20-30 births per day (roughly) -- somewhere around the 10,000+ per year mark. This is in stark contrast to the number of births any one woman will see, or indeed what any one midwife will see. Also, the pregnancies that are delivered in hospital are sometimes different from those that are delivered at home or in other non-hospital areas. That is, if you have a high-risk pregnancy, you are less likely to have the choice of a non-hospital birth. So midwives tend to see uncomplicated births, and any one woman is unlikely to have a very-complicated birth (some stellar exceptions on this thread ).
However, hospitals are going to see a lot of uncomplicated births as well as some very complicated ones. This means that rare problems will show up. This also means that people who work in hospitals know that it isn't a matter of if they will have to deal with an emergency sometime, but when. That's a very different perspective.
Hospital caregivers are also more likely to have either seen for themselves how badly things can go wrong, or have heard at close hand about something that went drastically wrong in an unexpected way. So sure, that effects how they practice. It can't not, at least not if you care at all about the people you are working with.
What this means is that while your own risk of something going haywire with your birth experience is pretty slim, the people who will be working with you are pretty much guaranteed to deal with haywire stuff on a pretty regular basis. They just don't know which person is going to lose that lottery, , so they try to prepare in all cases for what they would do if something went wrong -- so that they are ready when it does.
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I have to echo Belle on the IVs as well; they had to get a nurse anesthesiologist in to do mine, because apparently, pregnant woman veins are hard to get (especially mine, which are usually hard to get to begin with. I went through a period at about 4-5 months when I had the easiest time ever getting stuck, and then after that, it went back to very difficult.) Anyway, I was stuck twice before they called the nurse anesthesiologist in to do it, and then when they did, they forgot to tell her about the rubbing alcohol, and I had to remind them again...
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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I wanted to be at home for as much of labor as possible. For many reasons. I planned to go natural, and I felt I could cope better in my home than in a hospital. Maybe I was rebelling a bit since I secretly wanted a home birth and I knew it wasn't going to happen. I also knew that being "monitored" by nurses is way expensive. The less time you spend on their watch, the less money you spend.
Unfortunately, I kept going into "false" labor. Dialated to a six, and the contractions never *really* went anywhere time after time after time.
They kept telling me that if ever I wanted to give birth, the staff wouldn't turn me away. But I didn't want to deal with pitocin.
So after several times *not* going to the hospital, I finally decided to just go and get it over with! It was only 2 hours later she was born.
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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Another thing about IV's - I've experienced that too, where they were unable to get one started on me. I've been stuck over six times before they finally got a good vein.
But, I wanted to let you in on what happened when I went in to the hospital in labor with the twins. The nurse tried to start the IV and failed. She then told me that she was going to go get someone else who could probably get it, and told me to relax, and stay comfortable - then she wrapped my arms with heated blankets.
The more relaxed and comfortable you are, the easier it's going to be. A lot of anxiety is only going to make things worse. So, I relaxed for about ten minutes, warm and comfortable, and when they started the IV I didn't even feel it.
Relax, use your breathing techniques, and request some warm blankets if they seem to be having trouble. I don't know if the warmth helped make the veins easier to access or if it was just part of helping me relax - and I don't care - it worked!
Try not to think about the medical personnel as people who are interering in the type of birth you really wanted to have. Try to look at them as caring professionals who are dedicated to the health and safty of you and your baby. These people all want you and your baby to be safe and healthy. Everything they do is dedicated toward that end. Yes, it may be inconvenient, it may be frustrating and most of the precautions they take may not be necessary - but you don't know that for sure going in and neither do they. As CT said, they will have been there and seen what it's like when something goes wrong - and they don't want that for you and your little one.
You and the doctors and medical staff have the same goal - for you to leave that hospital safe and whole with your precious child in your arms. Try to remember they really are on your side. Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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Gee whiz, I think Belle is like the expert on IVs.
At any given time at the hospital where I worked, you might have ~10 nurses on the floor. Maybe 2 or 3 of them would be fairly new, another one might be having a migraine (but couldn't get a replacement in, as the float nurses were covering other floors), another 2 would be involved in another birth right at that very minute, one would have called in sick, one might literally have no depth perception ... you get the picture. There might be 1 or 2 nurses that are really really good at regular IVs, if you are lucky.
When the IV is put in in a non-emergency situation, you can wait until the best person available can give it a try. You have time to use a warm wrap first to dialate the blood vessels, maybe even some numbing medication first.
On the other hand, if something is going wrong and you need an IV right away, then you are going to have whoever is handy trying their best to get it in. Your body, if going into shock, will have dropped the blood pressure so that it's hard to find the vein -- instead of being plump and blue, it will be flat and pale. Your skin will be cold and clammy, so if you have veins that "roll," it will be harder to stabilize one for the poke. You'll already be stressed and afraid, causing pain to be harder to bear. If someone has to do a "blind poke" (when they can't see the vein), then all the surrounding vessels will clench up from pain and be even harder to find.
It's just so messy. Mind you, in my experience, there was always some way to get in an IV if it was an emergency. As a last resort (and I only did this once in three years: this for a 3-month old having a seizure), someone can use a large-bore needle that can be screwed directly through the shin or sternum to access the bone marrow. This hurts like the devil and it doesn't last as long for access, but it is there in an emergency.
So, the upshot is, if you are going to need IV access, you want it done before you get into an emergency. Of course, that doesn't mean you can't refuse an IV. Someone forcing something onto you is assault. You might not need it, but if you do, you'll be glad to have it. Only you can make that decision for yourself -- when the potential benefits weigh out the potential drawbacks. However, it's best to get as much information about the reasons behind it as possible in order to make an informed choice.
The downsides to having the IV port in place are few. It is a break through the skin barrier, and they are prone to infection if left in for many days. (Usually we would replace IVs every week, just to prevent this, in our long-term hospitalized patients. Or they would get a permanent port with infection barriers sewn in.) As long as it isn't hooked up to fluids, it doesn't limit mobility at all. Even if you are hooked up to liquids, you can still wander the halls.
And there is no needle left under the skin -- that's just for putting the line in. All that is left is a little plastic straw to access the vein. (Again, if you don't need it, that isn't much comfort -- but if you do, it's good. )
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Just ask for a nurse anesthesiologist or an anesthesiologist to do it if possible, especially if you have difficult veins to begin with, and ask that they do it, if possible, somewhere that's not near a bend in your body. They tried three times on me, as I said, and ended up with the IV in a slightly less comfortable place because when I bent my wrist, there was some discomfort. So if you do decide to let them do it, ask that they do everything possible to make you comfortable. And if it's not an emergency, there is no reason why they can't use an anesthetic, topical or otherwise, to make you more comfortable.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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From being behind the scenes, I feel pretty confident in saying that it isn't an issue of control or not wanting to deal with messiness, at least not from what I can see. At our birthing center, in early labor, eating was encouraged. As I said, they stocked a fridge for free.
When I worked in the infant ICU, I used to mosey on over to the delivery floor in order to check on how the deliveries were progressing for the women there. We attended all C-sections and were called to any "difficult" births -- "difficult" including ones where the fetal heartrate was worrisome, or where there was meconium in the amniotic fluid (a sign of fetal stress), and other things like that. So it was useful to get an idea of what might be coming up in the next few hours so we could be ready. Of course, a lot of the times things went haywire, it happened unexpectedly. (On the other hand, remember that these were not the vast majority of the births -- it's just that because there was such a volume of deliveries there, you knew all the rare stuff was going to show up.)
Women were discouraged from eating in late labor. Ice chips to wet the mouth were fine, but not solids or even lots of liquids. The reason for this was, like with the IV, a practical and patient-centered one. We knew that if a patient did need a C-section for something like a transverse lie, it could usually be done with just an epidural. (Every effort was made to allow the woman to stay conscious and as much in control as possible.) On the other hand, if there were an emergency C-section (= time to first cut less than 15 minutes), there would be no time to do an epidural. It would be emergency general anesthesia.
When you are under general anesthesia, all the muscles of your body are relaxed. This includes the esophageal muscles and folds that prevent food and liquid in the stomach from reflexing back into the esophagus and possibly into the airway. An emergency C-section on a woman with stuff in her stomach virtually guarantees that she will reflux up around the breathing tube and into her lungs. That means hydrochloric acid bathes some very delicate tissues. It is a nasty thing to happen. When I left my OB-Gyn rotation in med school, there was a woman in the ICU still recovering from this, having delivered her babies weeks before.
Again, though, this is a rare rare rare thing. In three years I only attended 3 emergency (or "crash") C-sections. Any one woman's risk of having this happen is vanishingly small, but in a place where there are thousands of deliveries a year, it isn't a matter of if, but when. We just are nevere sure which one it is going to be.
So the delivery floors were easily washed, and there might be blood or stool or whatever that gets them dirty. (A lot of women may stool while pushing, and it is perfectly normal. Someone will just reach down and cover it with a fresh cloth or pad so we keep the area as tidy as possible for when the baby comes out.) Nobody really cared -- birthing is juicy stuff ( ), and that can be really beautiful.
But when I'd make a midnight run through the nurses' room, if someone commented that a woman in late labor was eating or drinking, immediately we'd all start calculating her chances of needing a C-section, especially an emergency one. Again, vanishingly small odds for any given woman, but for us it was just a matter of when, not if. And you only had to see one to dread the next one with a fervent and abiding passion.
So for a pregnant woman getting ready to deliver, her own likelihood of having to go through this is teensy. For someone (say, a midwife) who delivers even a couple of hundred babies, her likelihood of being involved in such a circumstance are pretty small, too. Most births are uncomplicated, and so one can "play the odds" and usually make it through okay. But when there are thousands of births, eventually it will happen. And so if you are responsible for thousands of births, you know this will come up eventually, and so you try to take reasonable precautions with everyone.
Now, this attitude of "preparing for the worst" may conflict directly with how you want to experience your pregnancy, Jenny. You'd said that you went into the first birth feeling strong and powerful and positive -- and that sounds like it is so cool, and such an awesome experience. You may find that you can incorporate some of these institutional guidelines into that feeling of power and control, or you may not. Either way, you may make the decision to abide by them regradless, or to pick and choose, or to ignore them. That is definitely your choice.
But I think it's worth knowing what the purpose is behind them, anyway. It helps you make informed choices. So, for example, if your husband did "sneak" food in for you during late labor ( ) and the very rare thing does end up happening, you and he need to know that this is going to be critical information to tell the medical team. They can try to suction as much out of the stomach as possible, and they try to wedge in a larger breathing tube in order to minimize leakage around it. Of course, these options are not ideal -- e.g., a wedged-in breathing tube is more traumatic to the surrounding tissues and likely to scar that part of the airway -- but in some cases, it is the best option left.
I don't want to scare you, but I do want to be careful and honest. There are reasons behind these silly-looking rules, and those are worth knowing. But -- in all likelihood -- they won't ever come into play for you. The people on the other side just have a different perspective, that's all.
Posts: 14017 | Registered: May 2000
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There definitely have been too many C-sections. I'm sure of that, and this was what I was taught by the OB/Gyns I worked under. One even showed me a large national study which demonstrated that the biggest predictor of whether a woman would have a C-section was the number of OB/Gyns in the immediate area who were qualified to do one. That was a part of my training -- to know what a problem this was. It was a focus of discussion for us.
On the other hand, sometimes they really are necessary.
Now, you could ask: so why not tell every woman that she shouldn't be eating late in labor so that if a breathing tube needs to be inserted, she won't choke on her own vomit?
*wry grin That would totally kill the mood. More seriously, it would mean something different to someone who is already in labor, in a hospital, maybe feeling out of her element and not in control. "Breathing tube? I need a breathing tube??" That discussion has a way different impact in the moment.
Ideally, this would have already been discussed in a non-threatening environment, like maybe early in the pregnancy at an OB/Gyn appointment. That way, there is plenty of time to think about it and ask more questions later. I don't know if anyone does this regularly -- I didn't see it, but then I never attended every visit for a particular woman.
Also, OBs want women to have positive experiences of their pregnancies and deliveries. They do know that the nurses will tell women not to eat in late labor, and the nurses know that they have told the women not to -- and frankly, I think there is a bit of odds-playing that goes on here, too. Most women will "follow the rules," so even if something unexpected happens, it will probably turn out okay. And for the women who didn't do what was recommended (because mabe they didn't have any idea why, and it seemed totally arbitrary!), well, the blame for it is easier to shift to them. For personal feelings of guilt as well as for legal reasons.
That's my best guess about how and why this tends to play out the way it does.
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Obviously I have no technical knowledge in the field but I'm going to say a few words anyways, and then everyone can kick me out.
It seems to me that non-hospital births (birthing-centers, calling a mid-wife to your home, etc...) are designed to give you, the mother, a positive experience. All the extraneous activities and "stuff" (scented oils for instance) are there to make you happy, or comfortable; which is great. If there are no major problems with the birth, and let's face it, women have been having them for a long time without hospital help, then it will be remembered as a positive experience, certainly compared to a birth that didn't take place in an environment specifically designed for comfort.
On the other hand, there's a reason for high mortality rate in childbirth (for parent and child), and this is why hospitals are here now. All of their extraneous equipment is there to keep you and your child healthy, in spite of emergencies. Having a child in the hospital can never be the positive experience that say a birthing center would be able to offer, they're simply not set up to give you that. They're there so that if anything happens you can be assured that you and your child will receive the best in medical care.
It's a trade off, and as someone who will never have to do this himself (duh ) I would always choose the latter. However, of course the choice should always be the mother's, whenever it can be afforded, I would never try to stop anyone from that (including my own wife).
But basically alternate birth locations are designed to maximize happiness in case of a normal, healthy birth, hospitals are designed to do everything possible in the case of a problem. So there is simply no way the second one can be as "good" as the first, but when something does happen and it's your life and the life of your child, that's when the reasons for the latter choice become obvious.
My two cents is on the table now.
And of course none of this is any sort of reason to keep anyone from trying to make the hospital the most comfortable birthing location that they can! It's more a little warning: "It's not as comfortable as you want, but remember what you're getting in exchange for comfort."
Just for clarity, the "birthing center" I reference above is actually a part of the hospital. They are able to maximize both safety and attentiveness that way, I think. (This is a fairly new trend, BTW.)
Perhaps one way of framing this is to think of the birthing process as a time of awesome power. Like all times and places of great power, there is potential for high wonder and danger, both. Just as one would not enter a sacred place of power casually, so one may not want to enter this place of sacred power without considering how to move in a careful (but controlled, non-passive, very engaged) way.
Kind of like doing honor to the power and sanctity of birth by acknowledging both fearsomeness and beauty. If one were to be blase about approaching a truly sacred place, one would be dishonoring that power.
Maybe just another perspective? A way of making sense of conflicting ideas and pulls on your spirit.
Regardless, I trust in you, my Jenny G, my vibrant and mystical Andrea, to make the best decision for you. You'll make sense of it in your context, and always, always, I am pro-Andrea.
[I'll write more about epidurals and other issues, later. I have to catch a flight to Miami. ]
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I have to say that although when I first got pregnant with Emma, I envisioned birth with a midwife in a birthing center, and that went straight out the window when I had bleeding at five or six weeks and had so call up an OB/GYN pretty much at random-- actually, it ended up being whichever one called back a new patient he'd never seen before on Labor Day-- went in for an emergency sonogram the next day, and began my journey into a "medical" birth (as opposed to a "natural" birth), I had a very positive, good experience in the end.
As I said, I switched OB/GYNs three times: the first because insurance decided not to cover my pregnancy, the next two becuase the doctors weren't listening to me. When I finally found a doctor who listened when I said "That hurts" during an exam and said, "I'm not sure why it does, because it usually doesn't, but I'll try to be more careful" instead of, "It shouldn't", I knew I'd found the right one. (This is also the doctor who took the call when the nurse said, "There's a patient who wants to switch doctors who is 26 weeks along. Do you want me to tell her no?" and, when hearing that the reason I wanted to switch doctors was "I've had prenatal care the whole time, but the doctor I'm seeing right now doesn't listen to me, and I don't trust him to make decisions, and he doesn't explain things to me when I ask, except by talking down to me," said, "Okay, why don't you come in next week, and we'll have a nice chat.")
The hospital was a positive, calm, happy environment-- no other way to put it, I walked into that L&D and thought, "I feel safe here". Even though I was being induced, everyone was making sure that I got things as much my way as possible. The nurse was wonderful. She knew her limits, and rather than trying again when she couldn't stick me for an IV, went out and got a nurse anesthesiologist to do it. They tried their best to make me comfortable, and when I insisted that my husband stay in the room for the epidural, against hospital policy, they aquiesced. They never made me feel unsafe, even when my blood pressure was dropping dramatically and they were freaking out a little; it's only in hindsight that I recognize it as freaking out. It was a very, very positive experience. In fact, I enjoyed it so much, if I have a chance, I would like to have my next child in the same hospital (albeit hopefully without the induction and perhaps without the epidural, although I'm not one of those "no pain relief ever" people; I know my limits, and when I reach them, I am prepared to change my mind. Especially during labor.)
I think that finding a hospital environment you are comfortable in is probably the thing that makes the most impact on whether it will be a good or a bad experience. I mean, to me, places have "vibes". The other hospitals I'd been in had vibes of "authoritarian, frightening, stern, confining". This one had vibes of "joyful, accomodating, pleasant, relaxing". I much preferred it. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Hobbes. It should also be pointed out that birth in free-standing birthing centers staffed by midwives has been shown to be safe, overall. There is always a back-up physician and arrangements to transfer to a hospital in case of emergency. Also, women with risk factors would not be accepted by a competent midwife for a home birth or a birth center birth. Since those giving birth in a non-hospital setting are by and large low-risk patients, there is actually a lower mortality rate in birthing centers than in hospitals.
Posts: 5771 | Registered: Nov 2000
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I'm just skipping to the end here, and I'll just say that my best birthing experience was with a military D.O. (which is pretty similar to an M.D.) my worst birth was with a midwife, and my other two were with doctors. The worst one for my husband was when I got an epidural (because I had a headcold I just couldn't concentrate). I've delivered with 4 different doctors, and I just feel like as long as my husband is coaching me, the doctor is there to support and take care of the really icky stuff. Bradley method is kind of the main husband coaching program.
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quote:They never made me feel unsafe, even when my blood pressure was dropping dramatically and they were freaking out a little.
kq, I had the opposite problem with the same result. My blood pressure, already too high, was climbing steadily higher. They gave me magnesium sulfate to keep me from convulsing (they didn't tell me that at the time...a good thing) which convinced me that you shouldn't eat while you're in labor. One of mag sulfate's many unpleasant side effects is that it may make you throw up....I *really* freaked out when I thought I was throwing up blood. That ended up being a bit of comic relief when the nurse reminded me that I'd just had a dish of raspberry jello.
Posts: 5948 | Registered: Jun 2001
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CT, I have read probably a dozen books on pregnancy and/or L&D, took birthing classes and a refresher course, have discussed L&D with many moms, several L&D nurses, and at least two doctors, and have NEVER been told any reason for the not eating except the concern about vomiting. (Now, I was being facetious when I talked about the mess. It has generally been explained to me that a woman in transition with a full stomach is highly likely to vomit, which is certainly no fun -- even when you aren't having killer contractions.)
Your explanation makes SO MUCH more sense!
*feels edumacated*
quote: I think that finding a hospital environment you are comfortable in is probably the thing that makes the most impact on whether it will be a good or a bad experience.
I strongly agree. However, the vibes of a place will vary from day to day. I had all three kids in the same hospital. I was very happy with my interactions (with one or two exceptions that were confined to specific individuals) with my first two, and very unhappy with the third.
The main difference? With my third I was there on an unusually busy day in a particularly busy month. That meant the room was smaller and had no window, and the nurses were far more stressed and overworked. Among other things, it almost certainly contributed to the fact that my doctor did not receive the call (hospital says they paged her, she says no -- who knows where the error was) to come when I suddenly went from 7 to 10 cm.
I had done fine with no written birth plan with the first two, and really really regretted not having one with the third. I was unhappy enough that even now, almost 6 years later, I would be very hesitant to have another child in that hospital -- and I would not have hesitated for a moment after the first two.
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Oh, I also wanted to say Jenny, that when I had my first in hospital 8 years ago, I had no IV, and ate and drank the whole time.
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You are all so beautiful! It's not so scary when I know the reasons behind things, and what I can reasonably do without upsetting "standard procedures" too much. I figure my two mantras will be "Fear is the mind-killer..." and "CT explained this. It'll be okay."
My biggest fears involve following the crowd and having things done to me that I don't understand. So, you all are helping me feel better. I found out that there IS a doctor in town that uses nurse-midwives. I might check him out (he actually delivered my baby sister!). And I totally understand and appreciate the role of modern medicine in childbirth. So many babies and mothers are helped.
The discussion of the different types of services and why they exist helps, too. It helps me think of the perspectives of the people I'll be working with. Now I can see them as human rather than alien.
And CT, your faith in me makes me feel both humble and proud. I have faith in you, too. I wish I could have YOU with me at my birthings.
And all the ladies sharing their birth experiences/stories, thank you so much. It helps to know how things went for others and it makes me much less afraid.
I love you, Hatrack! Posts: 3141 | Registered: Apr 2000
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(((hugs))) You are awesome, Andrea. When are you due? As I said in Mrs. M's thread, I really want to make something for your babiness.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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My experience with medical services of any kind has been extremely limited. I can count the number of times I went to a clinic as a kid on one hand, I've never had to go to a hospital for myself, and I don't think I've ever "had" a doctor the way everyone else seems to "have" a particular doctor. However, since I've been on birth control for the past 4 years, I've had to jump through whatever hoops there are to get the pill and then the shot.
Most of my visits have been quite pleasant, when I get a nurse who is as cool as I imagine CT to be. Sometimes, though, and more often now that I go to the Planned Parenthood for my shots, I get someone who seems to think THEY own my body. For instance, I have a lot of moles on my skin. Like mega-freckles. I haven't met a medical professional yet who hasn't commented on them. Gentle comments and suggestions I don't mind, but the people who seem to think it's their job to try to browbeat me into having something done about them piss me off to no end. It reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where the overbearing mechanic eventually ends up stealing Jerry's car. Ugh!
I guess it's safe to say that I'll be pushing for a birthing center over a hospital experience someday. I understand completely what CT is saying about the perceived necessity of the precautions, but I fully expect my strong child-birthing hips to get me through any future pregnancies just fine. No matter what that mean old nurse at PP says!
posted
Maybe, but how could I pass up the opportunity to slip a Tolkein-esque pun into a general well-intended wish, especially considering the audience?
-Trevor
PS: I debated over which would be better for the phrasing - "Mary" or "Merry". But I was trying to avoid the religious implications. Posts: 5413 | Registered: Jun 2004
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Hey, when you push a person out of a hole that is normally less than the size of a dime, you are welcome to make jokes. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Yes, well, thank your defective chromosome that the kidneystone wasn't as big as your fist, 'cause that's kind of what it might be like.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Out of curiosity....I'm flailing for comparison here. I hear often that childbirth is the worst possible pain, and I don't want to dispute that, but I'm trying to get a handle on the concept. So....have any of you who have been pregnant had operations on your spine? I know having my lower back fused is the worst it's ever gotten for me. If so, how much worse was childbirth?
Posts: 1114 | Registered: Mar 2004
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I don't think it is the worst possible pain. Probably far from it, when the birth happens without complication and the woman is well prepared to cope. There are so many different kinds of pain. A burn has it's own unique agony. Intense eye-pain will drive you insane.
But most of all, I think why women talk about it that way is that it is something that your body does--and you can't really control it. It's like you've been possessed by some immense, uncontrollable force. All you can do is cope, surrender, let it go. And if you don't, the pain only gets worse. Fear brings you from feeling intense to true suffering, because you panic and go into shock. Panic in pain is one of the worst of all human experiences, IMO.
It's like getting on a tremendous roller coaster. On this ride, you know it is going to keep getting more and more intense--there's no getting off until you've run the course.
And after all that intense pressure and squeezing, you have to pass a boulder through your hips. It doesn't tickle. And men, I don't care what you've crapped, I seriously doubt it was baby-sized.
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
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I'm with bev here. It's not that it's painful, exactly; I had very good pain medication, at least by the end. But your body stretches in ways that you never knew it could stretch until you had to try, and it takes a while to recover, even if your labor and delivery were normal, uncomplicated, and all around not that bad.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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I would imagine it's very tough to judge, as I understand it when in labor a woman's body releases something like 9 times the normal amount of testosterone, which either reduces the pain felt or ability to cope, I don't remember.
But I'm not sure that's true, someone else back me up/know this isn't true?
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When I get off the phone with my mother, I am going to read this thread very carefully, now that I have a vested interest interest in this subject.
I'm definitely giving birth in a hospital. I've always felt safe in hospitals and I've been lucky to have wonderful experiences. Also, this is a high-risk pregnancy and I want to have doctors on hand just in case.
Posts: 3037 | Registered: Jan 2002
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Mrs. M, you should also read the thread Space Opera started on natural cold remedies. Some good advice for when you get a cold in there.
Hobbes, I don't care if it's true or not, and it probably is, don't tell a woman in labor that anything has "reduced her ability to cope". That's a good way to get smacked across the room. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Just imagine pooping a pumpkin. That's the husband's family's way of putting it.
It's painful, yes. But the way it was explained to me when I went in all cocky is that it's like running a marathon. Your body cries out but there is a purpose to the pain. Having the baby is winning the race.
Posts: 3141 | Registered: Apr 2000
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quote:Hobbes, I don't care if it's true or not, and it probably is, don't tell a woman in labor that anything has "reduced her ability to cope". That's a good way to get smacked across the room.
Yah well my sentance was missing a word, it was supposed to be reduce ability to feel pain, or increase ability to cope with pain.
Beautifully said, Jenny. As the third Y Chromosome to post in this thread, I would like to say that this thread is very informative for the guys too. You gotta love the ladies of Hatrack.
Posts: 786 | Registered: Jun 2003
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Hobbes, you just wait until your wife is in transition. I don't care if she's the nicest woman in the world (and your future wife may well be ), it's quite easy to get irrational.
They were telling my husband to go to the bathroom and change into scrubs, and I was convinced that he was going to leave and not come back, because he was too grossed out and didn't want to see it. When I finally said, "Why are you trying to leave me? " he just looked at me, looked at the nurse, said, "I'm not going anywhere, sweetheart," and put the scrubs on over his clothes, right next to the bed.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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quote:Hobbes, you just wait until your wife is in transition. I don't care if she's the nicest woman in the world (and your future wife may well be ), it's quite easy to get irrational.
OK, but I'm not sure what this is in response to...
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It's in response to you thinking women in labor can cope. We can, but not in the ways you might expect. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Yes, well, sometimes the increase in ability to cope with pain comes from displacing it onto the husband. Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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That's what my husband said. If she wants to squeeze your hand, give her two fingers. That way, it's almost impossible for her to break them. (Although I came pretty close with my husband's fingers.)
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, so they try to prepare in all cases for what they would do if something went wrong -- so that they are ready when it does.![[Wave]](graemlins/wave.gif)
Hobbes)![[Group Hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
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Trevor, Merry would be awfully big to push out...
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" he just looked at me, looked at the nurse, said, "I'm not going anywhere, sweetheart," and put the scrubs on over his clothes, right next to the bed.
