posted
I'm so disgusted with the Republican candidates and the pandering to evangelicals that I want to hurl. It's sickening how many evangelicals know what's best for me and how I must live my life.
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posted
I don't see a problem with that myself Hitoshi, as it is the right of all people in the United States to make the nation in their own image. It sickens me that there are so many liberals who do the same with me and my life.
The problem is that many evangilicals are filled with hate and lack of charity. They don't view people as simply wrong, but as downright evil. What is bad is that there are so-called liberals and some athiests who are taking up the same attitudes. It might make for interesting politics, but horrible civilized dialogue.
Posts: 2207 | Registered: Oct 2003
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quote:Originally posted by dkw: Something I thought of while reading stihl1's 1:10 post -- is it possible they're using "values" in the organizational "mission-vision-values" sense? We've all been treating the statement as if values = moral values, but it wouldn't have to, necessarily. In the mission-vision-values sense they could easily have a value such as "we value the Bible as uniquely the authoritative Word of God and only book of scripture" or something that would make the LDS "open canon" directly opposed to that value.
As I understand it, and from what I gathered from listening to evagelical types, that is basically correct. Many of the people who believe in evangelical faiths take the bible as the absolute truth and do not do well when people start to change or disagree with it.
There is also the possibility that it was simply the misconception that people still have that mormons are polygamists, as well.
Posts: 1042 | Registered: Jan 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Occasional: I don't see a problem with that myself Hitoshi, as it is the right of all people in the United States to make the nation in their own image. It sickens me that there are so many liberals who do the same with me and my life.
The problem is that many evangilicals are filled with hate and lack of charity. They don't view people as simply wrong, but as downright evil. What is bad is that there are so-called liberals and some athiests who are taking up the same attitudes. It might make for interesting politics, but horrible civilized dialogue.
Actually, it doesn't make for interesting politics, it turns into "I'll hate you for this" and then "I'll hate you in return for that". When we stop respecting each others opinions and have to start one-upping the other side to "get even" is where civility ends.
I see a lot of people (my brother) who disagree with the other side and start to dislike everything about the other side because of their politics. My brother is turning into a devout anti-christian, and I suspect it has a lot to do with his dislike for conservative politics, and not because his personal beliefs about faith. It is sad to me to see that, because there's a chance God will never reach him because his heart is clouded by hate for people who act in God's name. Whether or not they work with God's word.
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quote:Originally posted by Occasional: I don't see a problem with that myself Hitoshi, as it is the right of all people in the United States to make the nation in their own image. It sickens me that there are so many liberals who do the same with me and my life.
We don't want to control your life - just your money!
And when I am in a not-very-charitable mood and somseone tells me he takes the Bible "literally", I am tempted to ask how many coats he owns. (Luke 3:11).
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posted
One last thought for now (I hate monopolizing posts). I thought about this for a while after I left the computer today and while discussing it with my wife, she brought something to my attention. When I explained the conversation, she said "You're not christian, you're catholic." I then had to explain to her my side, that anyone believing in Jesus is a christian. She has littel experience with the catholic church, and was raised in the evangelical side of things. So her understanding of the word christian meant people who believed like the people around her, like the evangelicals. And really, until I was exposed to her and her family I hadn't really heard of people thinking that catholics weren't christians. And that's basically when my introduction to the evangelical world began.
The word "christian" has come to take on the meaning, in today's society, of the evangelical brand of christianity. At least to the evangelicals. And it kinda takes on a different connotation than just believing in Christ. It envolves the whole behavior of that religion and the beliefs and the above discussed "values". Which is maybe the cause of believing catholics and mormons aren't christian, or maybe the result I'm not sure.
One thing is for sure, though, I never had that idea or conception of the word nor was I taught to believe that's what the word meant, and nor do I believe it now.
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And when I am in a not-very-charitable mood and somseone tells me he takes the Bible "literally", I am tempted to ask how many coats he owns. (Luke 3:11).
quote:Originally posted by Occasional: I don't see a problem with that myself Hitoshi, as it is the right of all people in the United States to make the nation in their own image. It sickens me that there are so many liberals who do the same with me and my life.
Yes, but does their right to make their nation fit their lifestyle trump my right simple because I'm in a minority?
And how so for liberals? I'm not the one saying, "you can't have consensual sex with a person of the same gender or marry them," or "you can't have an abortion." (Not to imply you are; I'm talking about the Pat Robertson's of the nation.) This directly interferes in my right to "the pursuit of happiness" that I can't marry whomever I choose.
I mean, how ar eliberals attempts to expand rights imposing upon you? It doesn't force you to believe it's ok, just to not try and force me to remain unwed because you think it's "wrong." I think being a homophobic, power-hungry man is wrong, but I'm not attempting to limit what people say or do with their own lives.
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posted
Do you think that exclusivity is equal to, or necessarily leads to religious intolerance (disrespect)?
Posts: 14554 | Registered: Dec 1999
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quote:Equal to? Not necessarily. Leads to? Quite often.
In the same way that recognizing differences between the sexes can "lead to" sexual discrimination?
I doubt anyone here would say that the potential for an idea to "lead to" bad behavior should be sufficient reason to reject the idea.
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posted
Actually, I've seen people say that here (at Hatrack) with respect to religion in general and Christianity in particular.
I don't agree with the notion. I do think, however, that exclusivity carries within itself the seeds of some problems: - isolationism/insularity - unwarranted feelings of superiority - lack of understanding of others - idiosyncratic vocabulary
These "ills" are also apt to meet their mates in the actions/perceptions of those who are on the outside looking in: - suspicion - spreading incorrect information - fear and more
Sadly, I think these things are at the root of many of the problems in the world today, but solving it isn't as simply as pointing fingers to say "such and such group is isolationist and should stop" or "those suspicious folks just need to listen for awhile."
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No, I didn't think you were directing your comments precisely at Mormons.
