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Author Topic: "Evil Doppleganger" too cliche to use at all?
AstroStewart
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While recently pondering the ending to the 2nd book in a series I'm writing, I came up with what I thought would be a very fun, very exciting way to add new complications in to the 3rd volume.

In the process of defeating the major obstacle of book 2, one of the protagonists (a female, winged, "angel" type race, who is the quintessential "goodie two-shoes") is essentially "copied" by dark magic, creating an "evil twin" type of character, with an equal but opposite appearance (white wings -> black wings, light pinkish skin -> dark blue/purplish skin, etc) and an "evil" personality instead of a "good" one (obviously the character will be more complex than this, but this is just the idea in a nutshell).

My question, is this too cliche to do, despite how fun it would be to write? I know the rule is you can do anything, if it's done well, but let's assume you as a reader enjoyed the first 2 novels, and then you reach this plot point. Will you go "oooh nifty, now she's got an evil version running around" or will you respond with "wow how cheesy, a bizarro-superman storyarch." The magic that produces this effect is consistent with the magic of my world, so hopefully that isn't an issue, but is this trick just too overdone?

Thanks for any feedback.


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Marzo
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I think if I'd enjoyed the first two novels and came to that as the plot point of the third, I'd approach it with some skepticism because it isn't a unique idea. But that said, I'd still read on, unless the first two gave absolutely no premonition of this. I'd want there to have been some foreshadowing, but overall I wouldn't want it to deviate from the "feel" of the series.

There's not much worse than a long-running series starting to read like the author's pulling ideas from a plot hat at random.

If the evil twin was doing Terrible Unspeakable Things™ without a drive or motive I could relate to, just because she's the main antagonist of the story, I don't know if I'd want to read on.

However, if she reflects on her role as an "evil" twin, and has some sensible motivation towards her actions, I think that would totally give legitimacy and a nice flavor to the plot.

So, in other words - if you take the cookie straight out of the cutter, it wouldn't be something I'd want to read. But if you played with the dough a little, using that initial plot idea as a launching pad, then I think it could be very interesting indeed.

Of course, if you're not planning to polish and send off the manuscript at all, you can do whatever you want. ;)

Good luck on this! :)


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InarticulateBabbler
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I think the main difference between Bizzaro and Sinestro and your idea has to be characterization. The DC Comics villians were carboard-cut-out supervillians. If you are going to do this, breathe life into her black soul!

PS - Don't call her Evil [Angel-type's Name]. From the moment she comes into being, separate her from her "twin".


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RMatthewWare
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Everything has been done. The question is, can you do it well? If you can, do it. The idea that people have duel natures, and that we must confront our darker aspects, is a very old idea. The reason we keep seeing it is because it is important, and something everyone has to face. So I say, go with it. It will be unique because it will be the first time your character has had to go through it.

Matt


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KayTi
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I think you'd have to work both edges of the opposite sword to have this feel most believable/least likely to make your readers pitch the book across the room and curse your name.

So - if white angel has an annoying habit of plucking all her eyebrow hairs, black angel should have bushy eyebrows. If white angel is a really good pool player, black angel should be terrible at it (but maybe think she's good.) Play on personality traits too - there are things that white angel does/is like that could be *positives* for black angel. For instance, white angel is sappy and gets taken by every sob story. Black angel is much more cynical, but that cynicism pays off for her in that she avoids being taken advantage of.

I'm trying to come up with some other personality trait that, when viewed as an opposite, is really a positive - but I'm just drawing a blank. A bit fried tonight. Hope this helps a bit!


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Robert Nowall
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I'm inclined to think "evil twin" belongs in the "overused" basket, however it emerges out of the story. But so do a lot of ideas, some of which I help myself to along the way. Go for it, especially if it's fun to write.
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rstegman
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One thing to do is to have the evil twin do things that when you look deeper into what she is up to, she is actually doing good, while the other one is evil.

I assume your good angel is off on some quest or another. Write the evil twin in a way where she is trying to protect her people against evil thieves. Make it honestly look like the good angel is actually doing criminal acts against society, at least from the society the dark angel lives in.
One could have all sorts of "evil" acts in a society, but still have a code of conduct, rules that everybody lives by to keep a civlization running. The dark angel enforces, believes, and follows those rules.

Using this as your basis for your dark angel, it would show a definate difference between the two of them, both being evil in each other's eyes, yet totally believeable to the reader.


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tnwilz
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I think doing it well means dressing it up so that the situation has so much unique character that nobody really sees it as "Done." You mention DC but what about the Romulans and Vulcans? Again its the same concept, but with so much character and development that it doesn't occur to you that this has been "Done."

Tracy


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RMatthewWare
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Every hero needs a villain. Every protagonist needs an antagonist. When you write a story where the main character has a goal, there will be someone or something standing in the way of that goal. That's how you get conflict. In your story, your character's conflict will simply be a reverse carbon copy of themselves. Don't do this lightly. Go into depth and detail. It shouldn't just be a Superman type fight where the good guy simply kicks the bad guy's butt. It should be more of a battle of the wills. Each one thinks they are right, and that they are justified in doing what they want. Spend enough time on both sides (like a debate) you each side has plausibility.

Matt


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HuntGod
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Good villains don't know there villains...

The evil twin could be just extremely zealous...Punisher (marvel comics) comes to mind. He started out as a character who gunned down people for littering and then developed into a more classic anti-hero.


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AstroStewart
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Thanks for all the great suggestions. Some of them I was already think about (obviously make the "evil copy" not really pure evil for evil's sake, and give her character a life of its own, this is a MUST or there is no way around the cliche.) Also, many of your great suggestions have made me consider whether it will truly be an "evil" doppleganger, or just an opposite one.

Opposite doesn't necessarily have to mean one is good and the other is bad. I was thinking of separating the original good angel into essentially her supernatural-like traits vs. her mortal traits. Thus, the "good" version that is left (at least after the developments I've already set down for what separates her humanity from her supernaturality... (it's a word right?)) anyway the good version will probably become much more strict and emotionless, and unwavering so far as breaking the rules to get the job done. In the end, this can be a bad thing. Think if a policeman refused to, say, J-walk or run a red light to catch a murderer because "it's bad to break the law" is taken to the extreme.

On the other hand, this new, dark angel version, instead of being "evil" could simply be more instinctive, impulsive and chaotic. This one, while not necessarily evil, might not have any qualms about breaking societies norms to fulfill her own desires, whether those norms are simple things like dress code and ediquette. Or more severe laws like theft, or murder, etc. Perhaps she has no ability to differentiate between right and wrong whatsoever, even if she does her best to not be "evil" she just can't tell the difference...

So in some sense, the original character that existed really won't anymore. She will have split into alternate aspects of her psyche. The "good" version will be moralistic and conscience-based, while the "evil" version will be primarily egotistical and impulsive.

Wow, now that I've really defined what I was thinking, this would essentially represent a division of this character between Freud's definitions of the id and the superego. Without an ego to balance the two, both can be highly destructive, just in different ways.

Any further discussion about this idea, or the concept at large, are most welcome, and thanks for all the great comments so far


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InarticulateBabbler
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Frank Castle (The Punisher) is an excellent example of the antihero. He's only a hero because he vanquishes worse villians.

Azrael (Who temporarily replaced Batman when Bane snapped his spine) is more of the unknowing villian. He feels completely justified killing innocents if they're in his way, or letting them die to achieve his objective.

This is very much like MoonKnight, of Marvel Comics fame, except that Marc Spectre believes his is Konshu's Avatar on earth.


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debhoag
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I think another point to consider is that the "evil twin" idea has been done so much because it resonates with people so much. It's an externalization of the deep, secret desires we all carry inside of us and cannot bring to light. And we never get tired or reading about ourselves. I think the trick is to make the "evil" character as sympathetic in it's own tortured, twisted, siblimely nasty way - as the "good" character is. There's a saying in a famous 12 step program that our character defects are our natural, God given instincts gone horribly wrong. And I think that's part of what makes the Vulcan/Romulan Dr. Jeckyll/Mr. Hyde thing work - you can see how both camps grew out of the same basic materials, if you get my drift. Go for it! Do Good! Live long and prosper!
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debhoag
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Continuing a thought about human instincts horribly twisted, and using Kyti's example of eyebrow plucking, say Angel is very meticulous about her grooming. Evil could be a big, horrible slob, delighting creating chaos out of order, or she could take the meticulousness to a whole nother realm and be obsessive/compulsive about body hair or washing, or have some odd . . .dust speck phobia or something.

I would be very interested in HOW a doppleganger develops intelligence and orientation (unless the pre-existing character and she share Angel's original store of information and knowledge at the time of the "making"). If you are going down to a cellular level, it could be something that happens to the chromosomes when they are forced to split unnaturally, or it could be the trauma of the pre-existing consciousness that "taints" or creates madness in the new character. This second possibility would also provide an explanation for how the characters share so many traits and memories, yet one views these events and memories in a completely different light than the other. If you decide to pursue this, I could shoot you some psychobabble that would fit. let me know. Deb


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rstegman
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One way to go is to have the logical and emotional split. The white angel is logical, the rules are to be followed.
The dark angel is emotional, will experiance all emotions to the extreme.

The light angel knows the rules, will follow them, will anylize things Her judgement would likely be impared. I would see her harming someone, even accidently, because she cannot logic what emotional damage might be caused. Because she no longer have pride, which is an emotion, she might let her self go slightly, or not be as stylish because it is logical to wear one type of clothing.

The dark angel might be one who explores pleasures, even forbidden ones (she understands the word no, but cannot see a reason to use it....), fly off the handle over little things, get revenge for slights. She would be fashonable and meticulous simply because it makes her feel good to have men ogle her.

If the two fight, it would be one heck of a battle. the logical one would be calculating well ahead of what they were doing to get the emotional one into a bad situation. The emotional one would be unpredictable in her actions, not following logic. Of course, the emotional one could be made angry and attack blindly.

Sorry for the rambling.


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InarticulateBabbler
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Wow. If you read everybody's posts, I think you have a basis for the Dark Angel's persona. LOL
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Antinomy
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A doppleganger of your MC is not cliche, but it is a topical trend considering the recent Spiderman III film release.

But hey, if the urge to write is inside you demanding to get out -- have at it!


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AstroStewart
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rstegman -- that was almost exactly what I had in mind. Essentially, that is a large factor in the difference between the id and the superego. The id requires immediate satisfaction. I would be like having a grown adult (with magical powers, no less) with the psychologocial development of a 2-year old. She would want everything now now now, regardless of well.. anything. If she gets upset over the slightest thing, it might result in murder, etc, because her entire world is egocentric. The only thing that matters are her base desires. Food. Sex. Pain-avoidance. This would tie in very closely with following every emotion she experiences to an extreme, without thought for conscience or morality at large.

Meanwhile, the superego is essentially the conscience, intent on following all of societies rules of right and wrong. It doesn't let you give in to your desires unless it is "acceptable" to do so, and could thus be seen as the perfect example of logic dictating behavior, utterly controlling ones emotions and desires.


As far as worrying that this is a topical trend (Spiderman 3, etc)... even if I managed to get an agent TODAY... this doppleganger doen'st come forth until the end of the 2nd book in this series. Spiderman 4 would probably be out in theaters before this novel ever hit shelves :P


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