posted
Congrats, Snapper For the record, I don't have kids, will sell my cat into lap slavery for 50 bucks, and I always try to get at least 3-4 hours of sleep a night
(also, were we competing? I don't get the "winning" thing there... Or are you just winning at your goals, in which case, awesome )
[This message has been edited by izanobu (edited March 03, 2011).]
quote:I am speaking Martian to the Venusians on that one.
You're also assuming that you know "The Answer to It All," with "It All" defined as success in the writing field. Now, I don't want to take someone's experience of "success" apart...but I could.
posted
I'm pretty sure that Winning is the title of Snapper's fifteenth published story. Or the market. Any other meaning falls under the heading PPBBBTTT!!! and does not help anyone.
(Just like Charlie Sheen.)
I think to continue on Brendan's middle path summation, I think there are things we can all agree on.
First, If you want to be a writer, then you must write. And then write, and write, and write some more.
Second, If you want to make money from writing you must submit your stories.
Third, If you want to make money from writing you must write stories that are worth paying for.
Fourth, In order to write stories that are worth paying for you must write, and write, and write some more.
Fifth, If you want to write stories for a full time living, there is luck and skill and dedication involved.
Sixth, If you can write stories for a living, there will be people who will resent you if you don't speak softly of your success. Also, try not to insult the people who resent you, or else civil discourse goes out the window.
Seventh, calling someone "a pretender who is wasting their time", is insulting, even if it is through subtext.
Eighth, even if you make writing a top priority, there are things that trump writing, such as family.
Nineth, every writer has a right to set their own priorities, and every writer has a chance achieve their dream. So long as they write, and write, and write some more.
Tenth, don't use humor that requires a sassy neck wag, if people can't see you snap your fingers.
posted
I have stayed out of this "controversial" discussion largely due to lack of time, which is ironic, I suppose, for a number of reasons. Circumstances, both within and outside my control, have forced me into a job where I make considerably less money than a year ago, but also affords me, as of this week, considerably more time to write. So far, I am enjoying my new position, and I plan to take advantage of this "opportunity".
At one time, I was working nights with an abundance of available free time - I could write while at work - but with very little pay. I didn't take advantage of that time as I should have. I remember the years between college and marriage and child, where free time was a commodity to spend at my own discretion. I didn't take advantage of that time as I should have. However, I am a firm believer in the "butterfly effect", and in many ways I'm happy with how things have evolved in my life.
On the otherhand, this doesn't mean I shouldn't take advantage of the time I now have. We can all look back and say, "Oh, I had so much more time then and now I don't." But this is not productive. Neither am I saying that anyone should seek lesser paying jobs or neglect responsibilities, such as time with or support of family, in order to write more. At the same time, I don't believe we should neglect our dreams. I believe we only go "this way" once, so why not make the best of it.
I recently listened to an audiobook of Blaze by "Richard Bachman". I can assure you that I have read better writing from just about everybody here at Hatrack. The story itself was okay, but there was nothing there that I nor any of you couldn't write (sorry for the double negatives, but I can't sufficiently convey this any other way). Any of us can become the next "Richard Bachman", or at least the next Stephenie Meyer. I believe it necessitates more of the right idea (and possibly the right luck) than talent. But you have to write, finish a story, and submit (my greatest weakness).
"Do, or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
[This message has been edited by philocinemas (edited March 04, 2011).]
posted
I could be wrong but isn't Richard Bachman a pen name that Stephen King ocassionally writes under?
Posts: 3072 | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
Thank you all for your comments. This has been one of the more enjoyable threads I've read on Hatrack.
I don't have much to add, except to say that you need to set your goals and stick to them no matter what level you are. As History said, success is in the eye of the writer who makes a goal and meets it.
If it's to live on your writing, then that's great. But if that's your goal then the Brad, Izanobu comments are very apt. You need to be able to write with discipline and make it a job. If you don't, then you should find another goal that doesn't include the requirement of discipline and the dedication of time.
But if your goal is to have fun while you write, then that's okay, too. But if you just want to have fun, then don't expect an editor to show up at your door with a book series contract.
I didn't sell any stories last year for one reason. I didn't submit enough. I sold a couple the year before, because I did submit. Write, submit, write, submit. If you're doing novels, then you've got to query and follow-up and continue to do it.
Publishing success will only come to those who put good content out there in front of those who will buy. Of course luck has something to do with it, but then luck has something to do with a lot of things in life.
This thread has inspired me to get more writing done and I thank you all for the inspiration.
[This message has been edited by Owasm (edited March 04, 2011).]
posted
I reflect back on the topic, "Am I serious?...", which I started because I procrastinated one morning from writing. Ironically, the story I was not working on was about two people trying to stop a "catalyst" who was about to start a riot (now appreciatively critiqued by four hatrackers).
I am sad to see that my characters did not stop the catalyst that morning: me.
Seeing people's frustrations with rejection slips and difficulties finding time to write makes this forum all the more crucial to be supportive. Whether a writer has xx pro sales or xx semipro sales or xx token sales or no sales at all, he (she) still has to battle to make progress in an extremely competitive field. There is always another page to turn. I imagine it is difficult for all of us regardless of abilities or experience. I would hate to see an "I quit this b" post over misunderstandings.
posted
Well put wordcaster. That has happened before. Sides are drawn, tempers flair, and a smart alec usually jumps in trying to make light of it all. Then She Who Must Be Obeyed is at her computer, tearing her hair out handfuls at a time, wondering what its going to take to put out this fire.
But I think more good has come out of this thread than bad. Everyone who has put in their two cents has done so with the intentions of helping their fellow colleague. Most see it that way, I think, and more than a few have said they have learned from this thread.
The biggest problem is the people who are reading this thread are in reality procrastinating and should be writing. Now my back to my story. I am falling behind on my personal word count goal tonight. (this post does not count)
posted
I think one reason I get heated up about this is as follows. I started writing in 1975. After thirty-five-going-on-thirty-six years at it, (1) I think I've spent plenty of time writing, and (2) I don't believe the Answer to It All is to spend more time writing.
There's also a point (3), but that'd just make some people angry...
posted
I agree Robert. I think there is a problem with the logic here. Brad and izanobu are only looking at the people who have suceeded and are making the big assumption that everyone who does not achieve their level of success isn't working hard enough.
That cannot be true, and there really is no way to figure out the statistics for what percentage of hard working, dedicated writers make it and what percentage don't (Well, you could determine this with an actual scientific study, but that hasn't been done here). So honestly, no myths have been debunked.
I'm with Snapper and Sheena on this one. You got to love to write. That itself has to be a reward because the truth is that you may not make it even if you are an awesome, dedicated, and hard working writer. Go team passion!
But seriously Brad, it is good advice, and the only thing we can control in this crazy publishing world is how hard we work. I'm all for hard work. Go team work ethic!
I think Philo makes an excellent point. I think what often (not always) catapults someone from midlist writer to the next Stephen King is an idea. An idea that strikes a cord into the heart of the masses. Whether you like Stephanie Myer or not, she did this. Her books resonated with many many people even if you were not one of them.
The problem is nobody, not writers, agents, or publishers can accurately predict what the next big idea will be. Fingers crossed, it could be mine.
A side note. Snapper I'm with you. I think Sheena will go pro. Is there a betting pool I can get in on? Honestly, I'd but money on you as well. For two people fighting for the passion, you guys are some seriously hard working writers.
Oh and Sheena, I wouldn't mind some tips on how you get 5 hours of writing in daily. That is awesome, you go girl.
[This message has been edited by MAP (edited March 05, 2011).]
posted
A sidebar to that were the comments about getting around and meeting people to help you get to "success." One of the things that really cheeses me off is the notion that it's not how good your writing is, it's who you know.
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posted
I think its a combination of everything. Time, writing, learning, and yeah, networking. The more people you know in the business who like your writing, like you, the more doors that should open.
The first writing book I ever read said, something along the lines of, writing for a living is like trying to go pro, let it be basketball or football or a rock star. It takes dedication, time, work, learning, and sacrifice. The one thing that writing offers that almost nothing really else does: The chance to start over, and over and over again. Think about it. A guy dreams of being a football player in the NFL he has one name, one chance, after all there is only 1 of him. Now a writer can change, his or her name, his or her genre. Can write again and again until he or she gets it right.
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For the record, I don't have kids, will sell my cat into lap slavery for 50 bucks, and I always try to get at least 3-4 hours of sleep a night 
