posted
Don’t get me wrong. Cell phones are wonderful. I really love that particular bit of technology. But I am becoming increasingly convinced that using a cell phone while driving is a really bad idea. And frankly, it’s starting to scare the heck outta me.
I’ve recently read about several fatal car wrecks attributed to the drivers text messaging while driving. I’d be willing to admit that a hands free phone MIGHT be ok because it allows one to keep his eyes on the road and both hands on the steering wheel, although I’m not convinced that talking to someone on the phone while driving is all that safe either. BUT HOW STUPID DOES ONE HAVE TO BE TO TEXT MESSAGE WHILE DRIVING?
In Mesa, Arizona my sister-in-law and her daughter were rammed and severely injured by a guy who ran a red light while reading a map. You’d think that a guy driving 50 miles an hour through heavy traffic would want to pay at least a little bit of attention to the road. If there is any difference between that kind of inattention and text messaging I fail to see that difference.
Several months ago I saw a guy holding his cell phone to his ear with one hand and gesturing with the other hand. I don’t know what, if anything, he was steering with. My advice to that guy would be to get a hands free phone. That would then free up both hands for gesturing. After all, it’s pretty tough to talk and get your point across without gesturing.
Just today I was almost hit by a driver who was holding a cell phone to her ear with her shoulder and tilted head, and was holding a piece of paper in front of the steering wheel with her hands. This was at a fairly busy intersection too. I don’t think she even saw me. (There’s never a cop around when you need one.) The way she was holding that phone I’d have to guess she was a secretary. Maybe to the gesturing guy.
Granted, those two are extreme cases, but every day I see several people driving holding a cell phone to their ear. I live in a very small very isolated community, and I just can’t believe that we have a higher percentage of idiot drivers than other communities. So there must be one heck of huge number of them throughout the country. Or maybe it is mostly just the tourist we get here in Page, Arizona driving that way. Who knows?
At any rate, the roads are starting to get scary. I sometimes feel like quitting my job and never leaving my house.
But wait a minute, several years ago a drunk driver rammed through my fence and ended up in my yard. Granted, he was merely drunk. (Too drunk to use a cell phone, actually.) But impaired is impaired. So it’s just a matter of time before someone driving under the influence of a phone tries to use someone’s living room as a road.
Great, I’m not even safe from stinking idiot drivers in my own house. Lovely.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
I just recently read a report that said hands free devices for phones don't make you any safer when driving. I was shocked when I read that, but it's apparently just as dangerous.
I think I also remember reading that results show your reaction time slowed just as much by driving while talking on your cell phone as being buzzed or drunk while driving. I'll see if I can find the studies when I have a sec.
Posts: 21898 | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
Wandering slightly off topic; isn't this the reason why there's an announcement in the front of buses requesting you not to speak with the driver? Apparently, involment in any lively discussion while driving seriously diminishes the amount of attention you can spare for the situation on the road.
Posts: 993 | Registered: Jul 2006
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posted
I just got my first cellphone and talked to my roommate for a whole 60 seconds while driving before I became totally disoriented and hung up without warning. Talking on the phone while driving is a very, very bad idea. Texting is ludicrous; I became very school marmish and insisted a friend stop texting when she was driving or I would jump out of the car.
Talking to someone who is in the car with you is a bit different because they are also aware of the surroundings, and can notice when you aren't listening because you are trying to be attentive.
Posts: 3936 | Registered: Jul 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: I just recently read a report that said hands free devices for phones don't make you any safer when driving. I was shocked when I read that, but it's apparently just as dangerous.
I think I also remember reading that results show your reaction time slowed just as much by driving while talking on your cell phone as being buzzed or drunk while driving. I'll see if I can find the studies when I have a sec.
There was a study several years ago that showed hands-free devices don't improve safety. I was surprised as well. Apparently it's the loss of attention focus that's dangerous. But surely texting is even worse: no focus on driving + fiddling with fingers + reading from screen.
Posts: 6316 | Registered: Jun 2003
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posted
Are there any studies on (as Eduardo mentioned) driving while engaging in a lively discussion with a passenger? I'm curious to see how that measures against hands-free cell phone usage. I have a hard time seeing the difference.
Posts: 3580 | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
If it's only the loss of attention (for regular phone conversations), then it must not be that dangerous -- or else talking to a passenger or listening to NPR are life-threatening activities.
Posts: 544 | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
My post wasn't founded on any knowledge about studies on the topic. But I do know that when my father's behind the wheel and he has to concentrate on where he's going - the effect is probably less on well-known routes - it's best not to engage him in a dialogue. On several occasions when I or my brother did so, he had more trouble focusing on his driving. Of course, one has to take into account that we were sitting on the backseat at the time, so my dad may just have had the inclination to turn his head towards the person he was speaking to. In this respect I think it would be safer for a driver to conduct a conversation with somebody on the passenger-seat. Since I don't have a license, I can't actually give you any firsthand experiences.
Posts: 993 | Registered: Jul 2006
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posted
I refuse to use my cell phone while I'm driving. The one time I have, I had gotten myself a little lost, and called my boyfriend while turning around on a little side road to see if he could help me. He didn't answer.
I think talking with passengers is probably a tiny bit safer, just because they are more likely to understand if you take a minute or two to respond.
Posts: 1547 | Registered: Jan 2004
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posted
See I've also read studies that concluded that cellphones impair reaction time just as badly as alcohol.
That being true, shouldn't the numbers of accidents involving cellphones be close to the numbers involving alcohol? I've yet to see such a study demonstrate this. I know this is really hard to test for as people after getting in accidents can just pop their cellphones in their pockets and not even mention being on the phone at the time. There is no test that I can think of that might prove they were using a cellphone at the time either.
I will admit that from personal experience, more often then not, when a driver does something stupid they are on a cellphone at the time.
In Singapore a man on a cellphone ran straight into a bus stop full of waiting people and killed several of them. Since then it has always been illegal to talk on anything but a hands free cellphone while driving. Hong Kong has similar legislation.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
Mandatory execution at the scene of an accident of anyone driving while using a cellphone. Then we'll how necessary cell phone use actually is.
Posts: 8501 | Registered: Jul 2001
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quote:Apparently, involment in any lively discussion while driving seriously diminishes the amount of attention you can spare for the situation on the road.
On a recent road, I was having a lively discussion that led to me not realizing that we drove TWO HOURS PAST THE EXIT! It added FOUR HOURS to a six-hour trip! AAAAAAA!!!
I completely believe that it's distracting.
Posts: 1753 | Registered: Aug 2002
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quote:Originally posted by MidnightBlue: I think talking with passengers is probably a tiny bit safer, just because they are more likely to understand if you take a minute or two to respond.
Which is why the only folks I talk to while driving are a couple of friends who will understand completely what it means if I say, "One sec!"
Also, while I don't text message at all, it actually is possible to do so hands-free. My ear bud allows me to dictate text messages. No idea how good the transcription is (although I'd guess not great), but it is an option.
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote: There is no test that I can think of that might prove they were using a cellphone at the time either.
I can think of one test that could be done. (That is if I understand correctly the capability of this technology.) But it might also involve a huge nightmarish quagmire of litigation and Bill of Rights issues, not to mention requiring more manpower in our law enforcement agencies. Whatever.
Anyway, the exact time of the accident or traffic violation would have to be known and the driver’s cell phone would have to be confiscated and his phone records checked. It makes me shutter to contemplate though.
I could cite many examples of highway stupidity I’ve seen. (Like the many idiots I saw in January on I-15, between Kaysville and South Salt Lake City, driving way too fast on an icy freeway. Or the many times I’ve seen people driving 80 mph at night in deer and elk infested territory.) But I won’t.
But what I’ve been wondering a lot about lately is whether or not a lot of people just don’t know what is safe and what is not. For instance, I wonder how many drivers know that the speed limit sign really means, “This is the upper limit for daytime driving in IDEAL conditions.” And that it does NOT mean, “This is the bare minimum speed at which you must ALWAYS travel, in fact we are just being conservative to appease old ladies and pansies, so 10 mph over that number should be just fine.”
I wonder about this awareness issue because I have not been required by the state of AZ to take any kind of driving test (written or practical) in over 30 years. I just go in and get a new license when mine has expired or worn out. And this last time they upped the expiration date to 15 years from the issue date. I don’t know if that is because I’m a geezer or if they do that in Arizona for all drivers.
At any rate, the only way the MVD folks have any inkling of whether or not I’m a good driver is by my record of wrecks and traffic violations. (Score so far is: Wrecks - zero; minor traffic violations - 2) I could just be an extremely lucky idiot for all they know.
So I’m wondering if there ought to be several kinds of tests each driver must pass every couple of years in order to keep his or her license. Or mandatory driving classes and refresher courses. Or some way of proving they know what is safe and what is not. Of course, I can see all kinds of problems with stuff like that, so maybe there just needs to be a lot more public awareness. I don’t know what the solution is. I just know there is a serious problem.
P.S. That “80 mph” above is just a guess. Maybe I should have said “like a bat outta heck” instead. It’s just that I keep getting passed at night like I’m standing still and I’m not that slow of a driver.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Samuel Bush: BlackBlade said:
quote: There is no test that I can think of that might prove they were using a cellphone at the time either.
I can think of one test that could be done. (That is if I understand correctly the capability of this technology.) But it might also involve a huge nightmarish quagmire of litigation and Bill of Rights issues, not to mention requiring more manpower in our law enforcement agencies. Whatever.
Anyway, the exact time of the accident or traffic violation would have to be known and the driver’s cell phone would have to be confiscated and his phone records checked. It makes me shutter to contemplate though.
I could cite many examples of highway stupidity I’ve seen. (Like the many idiots I saw in January on I-15, between Kaysville and South Salt Lake City, driving way too fast on an icy freeway. Or the many times I’ve seen people driving 80 mph at night in deer and elk infested territory.) But I won’t.
But what I’ve been wondering a lot about lately is whether or not a lot of people just don’t know what is safe and what is not. For instance, I wonder how many drivers know that the speed limit sign really means, “This is the upper limit for daytime driving in IDEAL conditions.” And that it does NOT mean, “This is the bare minimum speed at which you must ALWAYS travel, in fact we are just being conservative to appease old ladies and pansies, so 10 mph over that number should be just fine.”
I wonder about this awareness issue because I have not been required by the state of AZ to take any kind of driving test (written or practical) in over 30 years. I just go in and get a new license when mine has expired or worn out. And this last time they upped the expiration date to 15 years from the issue date. I don’t know if that is because I’m a geezer or if they do that in Arizona for all drivers.
At any rate, the only way the MVD folks have any inkling of whether or not I’m a good driver is by my record of wrecks and traffic violations. (Score so far is: Wrecks - zero; minor traffic violations - 2) I could just be an extremely lucky idiot for all they know.
So I’m wondering if there ought to be several kinds of tests each driver must pass every couple of years in order to keep his or her license. Or mandatory driving classes and refresher courses. Or some way of proving they know what is safe and what is not. Of course, I can see all kinds of problems with stuff like that, so maybe there just needs to be a lot more public awareness. I don’t know what the solution is. I just know there is a serious problem.
P.S. That “80 mph” above is just a guess. Maybe I should have said “like a bat outta heck” instead. It’s just that I keep getting passed at night like I’m standing still and I’m not that slow of a driver.
I thought about the exact same test but came to the same conclusion you did in that it would be virtually impossible in terms of constitutional rights to setup. That is why I did not suggest it.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
One of the things that frustrates me to no end is that I frequently see police officers driving while talking on their cell phone. They, of all people, should realize how dangerous that is.
I'm sure it also restricts their vision on the side where they're holding the phone, meaning they are not protecting and serving nearly as well as they should be.
It's my understanding that in 2008, a California law will go into effect saying that any cell-phone use in the car must be hands-free. I wonder if that won't just make things worse by doing little to actually address the problem, while satisfying many people who would otherwise push for stricter limitations.
posted
Personally, I think driving with distractions is something you can learn and become adept at doing. The real issue isn't how dangerous using a cellphone is while driving--it's how stupid your driver is. I'm confident in my ability to pay attention to the road AND eat a sandwich. If I have to drop both my hands from the wheel for a second and drive with my legs, I do it (and I KNOW people here know what I'm talking about). I talk on the cellphone all the time in the car. The difference is that I do it smart. Any time I have to do anything BUT follow the brake lights in front of me, I say "Hold On" and perform the merge/turn/friendly wave to the other idiot on the road. I make an effort to pay extra attention to the road while on the phone, also. It makes for weird conversations sometimes, but I'm more conscious of the road when I'm on the phone than when I'm not. My mind always wanders while listening to NPR. The point is that these are all equal distractions that will slightly impair your reaction time than if you were devoting 100% of your mental capacity to driving safely. NOBODY DOES THIS, so to me, what's important is to learn how to become a SMART driver, which means paying extra attention to the road when you do have to change the radio station or answer a business call.
I KNOW my driving isn't as impaired when I'm on the cellphone as when I'm drunk, because I know how hard it is to WALK when I'm drunk versus walking while talking on the phone. The studies are ridiculous. I also KNOW that driving with a hands-free phone is safer than driving with your hand on your head. I don't need a study to tell me otherwise. You people shouldn't either. It's common freaking sense that driving with two hands on the wheel is better than one. "YOU'RE STILL NOT SAFE ON THE ROAD BECAUSE OF..." is going to be a reality no matter what I do.
quote:Originally posted by Launchywiggin: Any time I have to do anything BUT follow the brake lights in front of me, I say "Hold On" and perform the merge/turn/friendly wave to the other idiot on the road.
Unfortunately, you don't get to pick when the kid runs into traffic or the car next to you serves into your lane.
They usually do so just when you think you're only following brake lights.
Posts: 3950 | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
Things that are “common freaking sense” to some folks may not be to other folks. “Common sense” has the connotation that it is something that any reasonably normal person should know instinctually or at lease be able to figure out for himself. I’ve not found that to always be the case. What may seem common sense to you and I may not seem a universal absolute law of the universe to someone else. Or they may know about it but not think it applies to themselves. Or they may drift along thinking they are pretty knowledgeable but find out there is more to the story than they thought.
When I first learned to drive, my brother-in-law taught me to always turn around and look behind me all the time I was backing. He explained it so well and the reasons it is important that it became part of me. So I always thought I was doing good. Common sense, certainly. But as it turns out it was common sense that didn’t go quite far enough, which I learned several years ago.
Fortunately I didn’t have to learn the lesson the hard way, but I did learn it just the same. And that is that every vehicle has a huge blind spot directly behind it. Some are worse than others. But you can fit a whole platoon of toddlers behind a vehicle and the driver will not be able to see them even if he conscientiously turns around and looks behind while at the steering wheel. (I am grateful to my company for making me take the Smith Driving course.)
So anyway, if it took me all these years to learn such an important bit of information, how many other drivers are out there who have no clue about certain things? And how many things are there about driving that I still do not know? And there are hundreds of little things like that that a person needs to know.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
I am actually *worse* with a passenger in the car than I am on a cell phone. It splits my senses more ways, because despite my best efforts, I glance over at the passenger while having the conversation.
For this reason if I have a passenger, and it isn't a long distance trip, I tend to drive like a fuddy duddy, because I've done both and decided lately I'd rather be driving too slow than too fast.
posted
I was almost hit by a driver using a cell phone while I was using a cross walk. And the guy had the nerve to look at me like it was my fault.
I'm the only person left that doesn't have a cell phone. I drive a manual car, and when I have a borrowed phone it makes it nearly impossible to drive. I need a hand to steer, a hand to shift, and a hand to hold the phone. So I either end up hanging up, or not steering. Same thing when I've tried to eat.
My dad is somehow convinced that talking on a phone doesn't change his driving at all. He always gets all angry when people talk about making it against the law.
I came the closest I ever have to getting in an accident last Sunday. On my way to church I was turning right at a green light. then just as my turn is complete I see in my rear-view a truck quickly switching lanes so as not to hit me. He just totally ran a red light. I don't know if he was on a cell phone, so I guess it isn't really relevant in this thread, but still..
Posts: 1287 | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
It IS illegal to drive while talking on a cell phone in NY, yet I'd have to guess that about 1 in 5 drivers seem to be talking on them. Makes me wonder how many are driving drunk, if there are that many willing to disobey such a commonsense law. The only difference is that you can tell just by looking whether someone is talking on a cell phone while driving: they're swerving all over the road.
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote:Unfortunately, you don't get to pick when the kid runs into traffic or the car next to you serves into your lane.
They usually do so just when you think you're only following brake lights.
Both good points that I would have better reaction time if I were devoting 100% of my focus to driving (which no one really does). People glance around. They change CDs/radio station. They mess with the A/C. Any one of these would be distracting enough to cause an accident just as much as talking on the cellphone (if not moreso).
You took the "following brake lights" literally, too. The point of using the phrase was to say that if there is any situation that opens the possibility for danger (like driving in a residential area with children playing or in heavy traffic), I hang up the phone. I'm an extremely attentive driver.
It's worth noting that both of your examples would not be my fault whether I was on the phone or asleep at the wheel. I did get the point, though--that I have absolutely no control over what anyone else does on the road, so I should be prepared.
I posted because I'm just really tired of the "TURN OFF THE PHONE AND DRIVE" campaign. Stupid drivers are going to get in wrecks with or without their cellphones. I've never gotten in a wreck and probably never will (one that's my fault, anyway)
If I do--I probably wouldn't have been able to prevent it if I got rid of every distraction in the car. Because sometimes wrecks just happen.
If I could have prevented it by getting rid of every distraction in the car (even my cellphone), I wouldn't do it.
It's funny that Glenn called it a "commonsense" law. I think it's a ridiculous law. And apparently I'm in the minority. I still think talking on the phone is no worse than listening to the radio or going through your day's schedule in your head.
And to Sam--I'm in total agreement. My perception of common sense is just that--my perception--what's obvious to me might be baffling to someone else, who might think it's better to drive with your hand on your head than to be driving with two hands on the wheel.
Posts: 1314 | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Regardless of what you think, actively talking on a cell phone IS very distracting and can easily cause mistakes, and IS more distracting than the radio or thinking about the day. Of course, being willing to stop talking on the phone to concentrate should the need arise, and using the phone only on well-known routes or when there is little chance of things catching you off-guard would make this less of a problem.While I can see that there are responsible times one could talk on the phone (I do occasionally while driving), I cannot see how the benefits of being able to talk while driving outweigh the good of the elimination of so many dumb mistakes caused by people getting caught up in their phone call. For directions, and for simply lengthy conversations, I can see a need to talk while driving, other than that you could just go into a parking lot or something while you talk. While I don't really support the campaign to ban cell phone use in cars,i support people being smart enough to use their phone sparingly, and carefully while driving.
Posts: 655 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
One of the things they've found about talking while driving is that the person on the other end of the phone often feels like they're being ignored when you negotiate an intersection or some such, so they actively try to draw you back into the conversation by making vocal changes and becoming more insistent.
I have personally noticed that I can't get someone who's on the phone to make eye contact with me. I was taught in driver's education that if you can make eye contact with another driver it minimizes your chance of having an accident.
Then there's the failing to notice that they're changing lanes or suddenly swerving to make the exit that they maybe almost missed, etc. It's a real problem when I can look at another vehicle and say "they're talking on the phone" and be right about it, with as much regularity as I have. Of course, it's easy enough to verify, because they're holding the phone right up to their face.
In fact, in 26 years of driving, I've only taken active notice of someone who I thought was driving drunk twice (and I wasn't able to verify it in either case). A third time I was following someone who was driving slowly, so I passed him. As I did, I saw him take a swig out of a beer can. I assume he was driving slowly so as to avoid being noticed. My guess is that's the case with most drunk drivers. I'm sure there are lots of them on the road, but they don't make themselves as obvious as people who are cell phoning while driving.
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Samuel Bush: For instance, I wonder how many drivers know that the speed limit sign really means, “This is the upper limit for daytime driving in IDEAL conditions.” And that it does NOT mean, “This is the bare minimum speed at which you must ALWAYS travel, in fact we are just being conservative to appease old ladies and pansies, so 10 mph over that number should be just fine.”
That's hogwash. Speed limits were reduced in the 1970s during the gas crisis to get people to drive at a more fuel efficient pace.
-o-
I think we should ban stupid drivers, and leave the cell phones, CD players, and whatnot alone.
Posts: 13680 | Registered: Mar 2002
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posted
Icarus, I will grant that what I said may be hogwash in some situations and under some road conditions. This is not a one size fits all proposition. Also I will grant that it was probably safe to drive a lot faster than 55 on many roads even under the old arbitrary 55 national speed limit. However, I reject the notion that present day speed limits are arbitrary.
And I agree with you that stupid drivers should be kept off the roads. That is why I was speculating about more testing than is done now.
But answer me this:
What is the safe driving speed at night on highway 89 between say Kanab, Utah and Panguitch, Utah?
The highway is two lanes (except for the rare passing lane). The posted speed limit is 65 (except for various curves and small towns which are posted lower). It is farm, ranch, and forest lands. It is infested with very massive mule deer and even larger elk every inch of the way. (In other words they range freely throughout the area.) At night, 50 yards is about all the farther you can spot one of these critters, and they give no warning when they walk out onto the road. (You might spot one just standing at the side of the road and you might think, “Ok, he’s not on the road so we are fine,” and then he could step out in front of you just about the time you get to him.) Then keep in mind that, when you are met by oncoming traffic, the glare of their headlights cuts your visibility down to about 10 to 20 yards on your side of the road and to even less than that on the left side. Several times I have seen a situation in which the only way I could tell there were deer crossing the road is because the deer partially occulted the oncoming headlights. Every time I have traveled that road I have seen anywhere from 3 to a dozen dead deer along the side of the highway.
So tell me what you think is a safe speed to drive that road at night. If you say 65 and you actually travel it that fast, I can’t promise you that you will hit a deer. You might run that gauntlet just fine. But I can promise you that you will be passed by many vehicles. And if they can’t pass you immediately they will tail gate you until they can.
Or what is the safe driving speed under the following conditions?: You are on I-15. The posted speed is 75. It snowed heavily that day and then most of the snow thawed by late afternoon so the roads are clear of snow but they are still wet. Now it is night and the temperature has dropped to around 29 degrees F. You know this because you have the radio on and the weather report just said what the temperature is.
My point is that even the old wimpy 55 mph national speed limit is too fast sometimes. At least that is my opinion. Yet I see many people who seem to think they are entitled to go 10 mph over the new 65 and 75 mph speed limits regardless of time of day, dust storms, smoke, snow storms, icy roads, deer infestations, or whatever. Of course I’m just guessing as to what they are thinking or if they are even thinking.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Starsnuffer: Regardless of what you think, actively talking on a cell phone IS very distracting and can easily cause mistakes, and IS more distracting than the radio or thinking about the day. Of course, being willing to stop talking on the phone to concentrate should the need arise, and using the phone only on well-known routes or when there is little chance of things catching you off-guard would make this less of a problem.While I can see that there are responsible times one could talk on the phone (I do occasionally while driving), I cannot see how the benefits of being able to talk while driving outweigh the good of the elimination of so many dumb mistakes caused by people getting caught up in their phone call. For directions, and for simply lengthy conversations, I can see a need to talk while driving, other than that you could just go into a parking lot or something while you talk. While I don't really support the campaign to ban cell phone use in cars,i support people being smart enough to use their phone sparingly, and carefully while driving.
FOR YOU, talking on the cell phone is more distracting than the radio or thinking about the day. I have been in one fender bender. Despite the fact that I talk on the phone all the time while driving, I got into said fender bender while I was not on the phone. I was driving to a midterm and was thinking about school. For me, on a long drive, talking on a cell phone can help keep my attention from drifting and can keep me more alert - I've driven from New Orleans to Tampa and back on several occasions, and it makes a huge difference.
Sorry, like Launchywiggin, I'm just really sick of the "hang up and drive" thing, too. I mean, people apply makeup in their cars. They eat lunch while driving. They have conversations with other people in their cars. I've seen a man READING A NOVEL while driving on the highway. There are plenty of other distracting things that people do while driving, and it annoys me that talking on the phone seems to be the only thing that people care about. Of course, many people find cell phones in general to be annoying and don't think anyone should ever take a call while in public, which I think is silly.
posted
All I'm saying is that every actual study I've seen of the effect of cell use on driving, has shown it to be highly detrimental to driving, and at that point I conclude that its effects are not up for opinion, and are facts. I think there isn't really a clear cut answer in all of this other than being reasonable. Talking does keep you more awake than listening to some soothing music that finishes you off as you're already falling to sleep, and in that regard is good. It takes away from your abilities, however, in a way that many other activities don't in the parts of the brain used to carry on a conversation. Eating a sandwich doesn't require you to keep track of things going on, while you must be alert to follow a conversation and therefore part of your paying attention leaves the road and goes to your call.
I simply condone good judgment enough to keep any activity done while driving safe.
Posts: 655 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
What's very evident in this thread is the hoary old adage about all males thinking they are above-average drivers. Or is it all Americans?
Posts: 6316 | Registered: Jun 2003
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Morbo: what's interesting is, that adage can be true, in a very real sense. After all, the quality of a driver is not an agreed-upon linear scale. Each person will have different qualities they consider important in a driver, and there are many qualities to consider. It makes sense that people would value qualities that tend to place them above average, and it is entirely possible that everyone who does think themselves above average in their own value system, is.
Posts: 15770 | Registered: Dec 2001
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This is crazy. Hey, Samuel Bush, my girlfriend was reading this thread and noticed something that I failed to notice.
You said...
quote: Or maybe it is mostly just the tourist we get here in Page, Arizona driving that way.
Somehow I missed that my first time through this thread! I live in Page, too! Small internet! Wow.
For those of you who don't know, this isn't like finding out a fellow Hatrack poster also lives in Los Angeles or something. Page is a tiny town where most everybody knows everybody else.
I'm sending you a private message, too. I'm pretty floored by this.
Edit: Okay, I forgot Hatrack lacks private messaging. So, I'll email you.
Posts: 3580 | Registered: Aug 2005
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I moved here from California, where I had a driver license. When I went to the AZ Department of Transportation, they gave me a new AZ driver license without any form of test whatsoever. Furthermore, my AZ driver license says it expires in 2050. That's just insane. I will still be able to use the same license in 40 years without any form of test or verification whatsoever.
Posts: 3580 | Registered: Aug 2005
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I was very sad when I moved away from Arizona and had to surrender my license. My license was good in Arizona until 2040. In Texas, only until 2009. Very, very sad.
Posts: 1001 | Registered: Mar 2006
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That reminds me of a true story. A few years ago my oldest son’s license was within a couple of weeks of expiring. I kept nagging him, like about everyday, to go get it renewed. I kept telling him that it would be a major hassle if he got pulled over with an expired license and even if he didn’t, it would be a hassle trying to renew it after it expired.
Well, he kept putting it off until after it expired. I finally prevailed on him to go in and take care of it but I flatly refused to let him drive to the MVD with an expired license. So I drove him in myself. While he was taking care of business, I happened to take a look at my own license . . . You guessed it. I had been driving with an expired license for about 4 months.
Moral of the story: Never ever, under any circumstances, let your smart alecy grown up son know that you have screwed up.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Samuel Bush: Well, hang me on the wall and call me Art!!! Another Hatrack person in good old Page. Imagine that.
Hope to run into you soon - figuratively speaking of course.
Made all the more hilarious when you consider what happened to one of my stores a few months back. Did you hear about that?
Posts: 3580 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Well, I know that Maverik was kind of destroyed by a wee fire recently. But that probably wasn’t one of your stores. So, no I didn’t hear about any other incident involving a local store recently. So don’t keep me in suspense. What happened?
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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Someone drove a car through the store (see? 'Run into you'? It's funny, except not anymore because I had to explain it. ). The car hit two people (they were injured but not too severely, thankfully). It made the front page... not that that's saying much.
But this was several months ago, and happened in the middle of the night, so it's not too big of a surprise.
What struck me was just how many police showed up. I think, if you ever wanted to rob a bank in Page, the plan is: Have an accomplice drive through a business off the mesa. While every single cop in town is down there pretending to be doing something worthwhile, knock over as many banks as you can.
Posts: 3580 | Registered: Aug 2005
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Anti driving-with-cellphone legislation was a great idea! Now obviously it should extend to maybe driving while texting. mayyyybe.
Posts: 15421 | Registered: Aug 2005
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I understand that distracted drivers have now edged out drunk drivers as the number one cause of vehicular accidents.
And it is getting worse. Just when I thought I’d seen everything, some new dumb ass idea comes along to help add to the many distractions on the road. Fifteen minutes ago (I’m not making this up) I was following a small pickup with an electronic marquee at the bottom of it’s license plate holder. At a stop sign I was able to get a glimpse of what I thought was “PRAISE THE LORD” scrolling across the stupid thing. So I sarcastically thought to myself, “Oh, that’s OK then. With a message like that, surely God will protect you from some idiot rear-ending you while trying to read your fancy new mobile marquee toy.”
But at the next stop light we were stopped long enough for me to see that the message was really, “PRAISE THE LOWERED”
Oh, so it is really a stinking advertisement of some kind - maybe some stupid car dealership lying about “lowered” prices. Or better yet, maybe it’s an ad for some auto insurance outfit with “lowered” auto insurance rates. Wouldn’t that be just delightfully ironic.
What are they going to think of next to plumb the depths of human stupidity? I just hope that the owner of that pickup is getting a tax deduction for his or her truck as an advertising expense.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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Oh, and another thing (just slightly related to this thread). This town has an ongoing plague of joggers who insist on jogging out in the roadway even though there is a perfectly good empty sidewalk just a few feet away. This used to bother me a lot. And I often wondered if people can really be this stupid. But then, a couple of weeks ago, a friend told me why this is happening. It seems that exercise gurus are saying that jogging on asphalt is a lot less stressful on one’s legs than running on cement. Not being a jogging aficionado, I can’t vouch for the truthfulness of this notion. I’ll just have to take the experts’ word for it.
So I guess it all makes perfect sense. And while the health conscious jogger who gets creamed by a drunk or distracted driver is laying in the hospital with massive internal injuries, he or she at least won’t have to worry about shin splints.
Posts: 631 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:Oh, so it is really a stinking advertisement of some kind - maybe some stupid car dealership lying about “lowered” prices. Or better yet, maybe it’s an ad for some auto insurance outfit with “lowered” auto insurance rates. Wouldn’t that be just delightfully ironic.
I suspect it refers to lowered suspensions. How much graound clearance did the truck have?
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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I don't know why people even attempt to talk on the phone while driving. It takes all of my attention not to get creamed in Fort Worth on a good day. Not even during rush hour.
Twice I have attempted to call my cousin to let her know I was on the way to her house. BOTH times I accidentally got in the left turn lane (at the same spot) and went the wrong direction. That was the end of my in-car phone usage.
About a week ago I faced a pedestrian's nightmare. Three people (women, actually) driving SUV's in the Wal-Mart parking lot almost hit each other, and the one in the back swerved around the two in front, almost hitting a random guy and me, who were in the pedestrian crossing. The guy pointed out to me that all three people were on their cell phones. The woman who almost hit us waved us out of HER way, all angrily. I wanted to kick her in the neck.
Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003
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Whatever.![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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). The car hit two people (they were injured but not too severely, thankfully). It made the front page... not that that's saying much. 
