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Author Topic: Job Hunting Support Thread
Belle
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Yay! neo-dragon! Good luck with both of them! Sounds like you did do a good job under stress. That has to count for something.
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neo-dragon
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Thanks! Actually, I think I learned today that interviews aren't as scary when you don't have time to stress over them. This actually changes how I will prepare for tomorrow. I think I really needed to know that I can walk into an interview without my usual scripted responses memorized and do even better! I also wish that I could do all my interviews in jeans and a t-shirt. I felt so much more at ease than when I'm in a suit and tie.
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Belle
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The tech center did not call today so I assume that means it's completely off the table. *sigh* I really wanted that one.

I can't hear back from yesterday's interview for at least the two weeks it has to be posted...so I'm on to other things. Unfortunately, there are no other things to consider...no new job postings at all. [Frown]

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ClaudiaTherese
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Belle, it has to just be a matter of time.

I'm searching now, even flying out of town for interviews, and I am astonished to realize all over again how demoralizing this process can be. It's a Catch-22: the less you have to be upbeat and positive about, the more you need to be upbeat and positive. What a viscious cycle.

Over the years, it has seemed to me that "chance favors the prepared" underlies success in times like this. It's just that the very act of preparing can make you less prepared because you stress out about it more, one way or the other.

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Belle
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I think it's starting to really wear on me. Today I needed to mail out a resume to a job that I heard about yesterday, and I had a completely "Why bother?" attitude about it. I forced myself to go to the post office and put it in the mail but I was so down about it I almost became scared by my own reaction.

I don't want to end up depressed about this, but it is so very upsetting and so hard to be rejected at every turn...most of the time without even an interview. It's not as if I'm under or over qualified or anything - I have all the certifications I need. Granted, I have no real experience, but most of the people I've seen in passing during my interviews are all new graduates too. You begin to wonder then if it's something personal about you - am I too old? Too unattractive? Too whatever?

I can't really pinpoint anything in that tech center interview that was negative...I thought I hit every note right. I even had experience in an academic lab similar to the one they have using a computer self-paced learning system almost identical to the one they use. So, I thought I had a real shot.

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neo-dragon
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I think that my interview today for that permanent position went awesome! But then, I've been disappointed before. All I can do is try and maintain a cautious optimism until I find out sometime next week.

I do know one thing for sure though. I've been offered the position for next semester at my current school! I should be happier about this. I now know that no matter what I'll still be teaching fulltime come September. But I really, REALLY want a permanent contract. I've been trying to get one for 2 years now. I know some lucky bastards who landed such contracts before they even had their education degrees in their hands. But then I also know of people who have been like me (a year here, a year there, etc...) for as long as 5 years. It hardly seems fair.

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Belle
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WTG neo-dragon! I am also conflicted because a long-term sub position came open near to home...but I also would prefer a permanent placement.

At any rate...I am still trying to be positive and hopeful. Now that the weekend is officially here, I can quit thinking about it for a while.

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Belle
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And the weekend is over and the new week came at me with a vengeance.

My contact at the board has informed me she knows of no more openings that will be forthcoming...and given that we are about at the limit where a person can contractually inform their principals they won't be coming back, I think she's probably right. Her recommendation is to look for long-term sub jobs.

I have literally cried for an hour and a half. My head hurts. I feel completely defeated, and that I have wasted my time and my family's money for the last three years getting my degree.

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neo-dragon
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Don't give up yet, Belle. It's impossible to know what will happen between now and September. It's not necessarily a zero sum game. Again, I don't know how things work where you are, but here, actual enrollment numbers sometimes work out to be higher than what was projected, which is what leads to teacher hiring continuing right through the summer.

(sigh) I'm so tired of seeing people being beaten down by the teacher hiring process; myself included. Even if I get the job that I'm really, REALLY, hoping and praying that I did, I still have friends out there who are in the mix. Just today one such friend emailed me expressing concern over the fact that he's applied for a half dozen positions without getting a single interview. Remember that as hard as this is, it's simply the part that precedes a long, successful, and rewarding career. Good luck to us all.

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Tstorm
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It's not over till the school year begins.

And a long-term sub job wouldn't necessarily be defeat, it could be just the opening you need to finish breaking down the door. [Smile]

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rivka
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Oh, Belle. [Frown] I'm sorry. That sucks.


quote:
Originally posted by Tstorm:
It's not over till the school year begins.

And a long-term sub job wouldn't necessarily be defeat, it could be just the opening you need to finish breaking down the door. [Smile]

Also very true.
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Sala
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quote:
It's not over till the school year begins.
It's not even over then. I already know that the three fourth grade classes where I teach will have 32 or more children, and Georgia's law says that the maximum is 28. But they won't hire a fourth teacher until they "see the whites of their eyes" for the first ten days of school. So it is very likely that on the eleventh day they will authorize the hiring of another teacher. Also, it is very likely that someone who was hired will have a change of heart once they actually get into the classroom, and bail out within the first month or two. I've seen that happen about six times. And, its very possible that a teacher becomes ill, pregnant, etc., and decides to not return, or starts back and then realizes that they shouldn't have returned, and then that position is open. So, never give up hope. And often, those long term sub positions lead to fulltime positions, especially since the admins see what a great job you're doing and its just easier to hire you on full time than to look for someone else.
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Sala
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So, in other words, don't give up, don't despair (I know, easier said than done). You have many people rooting (and praying) for you.
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scholarette
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Also, keep in mind, that your timing is not so great- which is not your fault. Hopefully, next year, things will be better and you'll have that degree still. So, it will not be a waste of money, just a delay. And things could still work out for this year.
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neo-dragon
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quote:
Originally posted by Sala:
quote:
It's not over till the school year begins.
It's not even over then. I already know that the three fourth grade classes where I teach will have 32 or more children, and Georgia's law says that the maximum is 28. But they won't hire a fourth teacher until they "see the whites of their eyes" for the first ten days of school.
Yes, that's exactly the kind of thing that I was talking about when I mentioned populations not matching projections and such. A lot of it is based on estimations and teachers do get hired even into the first couple of weeks of classes because any competent administration will rather err on the side of caution and start the year with possibly too few teachers knowing that they can hire more rather than have excess staff.
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katharina
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Oh, you have so not wasted time at all! This isn't the end of the search.

I wish that the jobs were like you can just graduate and then get then one you want and step right in. Sometimes it is true, but sometimes it isn't. It's really frustrating, but sometimes it's like all that school just qualified you to start your apprenticeships. I know that I've been working for eight years now, and it is only the last year that I'm in a job I don't see an end to in the next yea or two. I liked the other jobs a lot, but they were always a stepping stone to something better. On the other hand, there's no way I would have gotten my present job unless I had had those earlier stepping stone jobs, even though I am working in the field for which I have a degree.

In other words, a long-term sub job isn't the ideal or the ultimate goal at all, but it can be a stepping stone job. That's frustrating, but okay.

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neo-dragon
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Well, that permanent position which I thought I had an awesome interview for is listed as "filled". I think I can go out on a limb and assume that I would have been notified if I'm the one who's filling it [Frown] . Man, I really thought I nailed that one. It looks like I will be at my current school for another semester and then I can look forward to being back to square one for the 4th time in less than 3 years. Better than nothing though. At least I actually know what I'll be teaching months in advance for once.
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Belle
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So sorry, neo-dragon. [Frown]

I'm back in the saddle today. A position opened up about 30 miles from home and I'm sending everything. They want a lot...application, references, letter of completion...never mind that all that is online they insist on having hard copies.

At any rate...I'm still very discouraged and upset by the whole ordeal. Like neo-dragon, I have felt that I nailed every single interview. I can't point to anything I've done wrong. A friend who works at one school who rejected me said the principal moved a special education teacher over into the English slot instead of hiring me. She was one of my references, and said the principal came and asked about me and seemed very positive that she wanted to hire me...but instead moved the special educator over.

Plus, the fact that I was interviewed for one position before it even opened has me convinced now that every job that opens up is in fact, already filled and they are just posting it to fulfill the legal requirement. My friends in education this is often the case...that a principal decides who to hire long before a position actually gets posted.

Things feel hopeless. But I realize whining about it won't change that so I'm trying to suck it up and deal.

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Zalmoxis
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quote:
that a principal decides who to hire long before a position actually gets posted.
This is often the case in any public or non-profit position. Don't let it get you down. You just need to get in to the system somehow -- which is why long-term (or even a series of short-term) subbing is an excellent next step and nothing to be ashamed of.
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scifibum
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"This is often the case in any public or non-profit position."

In my experience it's very common in the business world as well. HR requires documentation of a candidate selection process, but it's often just a sham.

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Belle
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I just got a call for a second interview! Yay! This is the first time I've made it this far, so I am seriously excited. It's tomorrow at 10:30 am.
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katharina
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That's a very, very good sign! Yay!
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rivka
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*crosses fingers*
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Derrell
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Good luck.
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Sala
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My turn. My husband has been out of work for the past six years. His work prior to that has been sporadic at best. The longest he's been in one job is three years. He started out in our married life wanting to be a writer, and he's pursued that goal for most of our marriage (nearly 29 years now). For most of our marriage he had undiagnosed depression issues which displayed as anger which led to the loss of several jobs. After a major collapse four years ago he was diagnosed and started on medication and it has made a huge difference as far as that goes, but his sporadic job history has made it very difficult to get work.

All of this to say, he got a possible job offer today! He worked for a computer company for two weeks last year . . . it was meant to be two weeks, it was a temporary assignment. The company emailed him this week and asked if he was interested in a three to six month position which could possibly move from temporary to full time. He wrote back with a resounding yes.

Now, I just hope that he will get the job. He's been starting to slip in the depression department lately because the area we live in has the highest rate of unemployment of the entire state (12.6%). Anything is better than nothing, but this is actually a good paying job that will last longer than a couple of weeks. And, it could possibly get him the professional references that he hasn't had in so long for applying to other jobs if it doesn't last more than the three to six months.

So, wish us luck! And pray if you are so inclined.

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katharina
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That sounds wonderful for him. [Smile] Good luck!
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Belle
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Sala, good luck to your husband! It sounds like he has a good lead in a tough market and that is definitely something to celebrate. I hope he gets the temp position and that it turns into permanent.

I'm about to wash my hair and throw on some makeup and go. I'm really, really nervous. This interview is with the principal, the librarian, the drama teacher, and every English teacher from the school. The drama teacher called me and said all the other English teachers wanted to meet me. I'm really praying I have a good shot at this!

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imogen
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Best of luck, Belle. [Smile]
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Alcon
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Good luck Belle!
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Belle
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Oh man, how depressing. I assumed call backs were going to be held today and that there would only be a couple of us.

Instead, I found out that they were interviewing six people - 2 callbacks, me and one other, and four new people. Why interview new people if you already have folks you want to call back and decide from? Must be that you are not happy with the quality of your call backs and want to get some more candidates.

Plus, I could hear the interview of the person before me, and she has just moved back to Alabama from Georgia and has several years of experience...to my 15 weeks of student teaching.

I am dejected again. Doesn't seem to be much hope for me.

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katharina
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They would have to pay her more. [Smile] It's not over yet.
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scholarette
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I was talking to a future teacher today and he hasn't interviewed at all for next year. He has been subbing though and one of the principals he has worked with swears that there will be an opening- just the teacher has not submitted the paperwork yet. So, there is still hope.
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Tstorm
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quote:

They would have to pay her more. [Smile] It's not over yet.

Heh. Yup, for every benefit, there is a downside.

(Warm, cuddly blank statement intended to make Belle feel better.)

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by Belle:
Must be that you are not happy with the quality of your call backs and want to get some more candidates.

Not necessarily. First of all, schools like to have backup candidates on file (because if someone suddenly leaves mid-year, that way they already have people to call that have been through the interview process). Second of all, in some states/municipalities, they may be legally required (or not actually required, but inclined to to avoid legal issues) to interview all reasonable candidates until the job is actually filled.

I think you have a great shot at this. Good luck!


Sala, that sounds like a great start for your husband. Good luck!

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scifibum
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quote:
Why interview new people if you already have folks you want to call back and decide from? Must be that you are not happy with the quality of your call backs and want to get some more candidates.
Let me just add that if you have decided not to hire from already-interviewed candidates, you wouldn't invite them back for another interview.

You're just gonna have to face it, the 2nd interview is a good sign. [Wink]

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Tstorm
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quote:
First of all, schools like to have backup candidates on file (because if someone suddenly leaves mid-year, that way they already have people to call that have been through the interview process).
This, and they may want to have a few more 'interview backups'. Not everyone who interviews and is offered a position actually accepts it. At my current place of employment, pay is on the low side, compared to other geographic areas. When we interview 3 candidates, our first pick doesn't always accept.

As my father eloquently put it this year, when he was being interviewed/vetted for a position: I'm examining them as much as they're examining me. If there's something I don't like, there's no obligation on my part to accept the offer.

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rivka
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quote:
Originally posted by scifibum:
You're just gonna have to face it, the 2nd interview is a good sign. [Wink]

Yup. [Big Grin]

Tstorm, good point.

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Belle
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Thanks guys. I think I'm getting defensive...being pessimistic as a way to guard against all the disappointment I've been feeling lately.

One girl that interviewed after me is a friend...we spoke in the waiting room. She, however, is not certified so chances are not that good they would hire her over me. But, if they did...she is working at a Christian school and said she would recommend me to take her place. It doesn't pay as well as public school but it would be better than nothing.

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rivka
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Backup plans are good. *hug*
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scifibum
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I'm sure you are probably already doing what you can to stay positive, but try not to let pessimism take hold. It conceivably could affect the way you come across in interviews. Just remember, you are qualified, and you know you will do a good job, and you need to share those convictions with people who aren't yet aware of the facts.
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Alcon
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Hey Belle, any word yet from any of the recent interviews? Keep us updated, I've got my fingers crossed for you!

And in another note, I'm about to go talk to my current boss and ask him if he'll be my reference in my just beginning job search. *sigh* I feel like I was just doing this two months ago. Oh, wait, I was.

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Belle
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Nothing at all. They said they would notify everyone the day the job closes..which is Monday the 6th.

In other news, I applied for a long-term sub position. That felt like giving up and made me cry to do it but I have to face the facts I may not get a full time position. I need to cover my bases and have my options open. I also began looking into other institutions for job openings. I want to stay in education, so I've been looking at the local universities and junior colleges. There is an opportunity to be the supervisor for campus tutoring services. I also have the chance to be a part-time employee at the local junior college tutoring people with reading problems. I may have to pay my dues with the JuCo system while working on my master's and perhaps move into an instructor position with them.

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Alcon
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quote:
They said they would notify everyone the day the job closes..which is Monday the 6th.
It's not over yet then. But yeah, it's good to cover your bases. Dues paying time is disappointing, but it is something and may very well lead to you eventually being where you want. It just means it may take a little longer than you wanted.

Still maybe on June 6th... [Smile]

Well, for myself, I have a reference. Time to start sending out the resumes and see if I get any nibbles.

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BandoCommando
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Yay!!! I got my old job back!! Recall letter got emailed to me last week, I printed it, signed it, and faxed it in last night.

As a bonus, I'm also getting a student teacher next year!! Woot!
[Party]

Edit: hm...not quite a landmark post, but ah well. I'm satisfied.

[ June 30, 2009, 05:00 PM: Message edited by: BandoCommando ]

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rivka
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Sounds like a landmark to me! That must be a great relief, Bando!


Belle, good luck. I can't actually keep my fingers crossed for a whole week, but consider the thought there.

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Belle
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Bando that's awesome! Congratulations! Try not to abuse the student teacher too much. [Wink]
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BandoCommando
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Thanks rivka and Belle!

It was only 5 years ago that I was a student teacher myself, so I pretty clearly remember the agony of working pretty much a full time job and having to PAY for it through tuition. I promise I won't abuse the student teacher, but I hope I have some relevant and useful advice for her.

I'm really glad I got my old job back; it's a great school with good support from both the parents and the administration (this support being a large factor in my recall). Also, I'm currently attending a summer graduate program, and one of my prospects wanted me to drive back up home (a 5 hour car trip, one way) last Monday for an interview. This would have caused me to miss a day of my two-week session, and would have likely delayed my degree for a year. To boot, it wasn't a position I was terribly enthusiastic about. So when I got the news, I was thrilled to be able to withdraw my application from that particular job.

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Belle
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Well the sixth came and went with no call. I'm assuming that I did not get the job and will get a form letter in the mail to that effect.

I did better...only cried for a minute and that was because a good friend called me to check on me and see how I was doing. I was handling it really well until I got some sympathy. [Smile] I wiped my eyes and told her I would be applying for sub jobs this week.

I got a message back from my contact at the board of ed who said, in a nutshell "Don't give up. But, I will serve as a reference for you to get on our sub list." That pretty much tells me what I need to know, huh?

I am looking at furthering my education. If I don't get a full time job, I will sub and try to bank enough to cover tuition by January. Then, I'll start a master's program. I don't think getting a master's in my current certification really makes me much more employable, so I'm going to add another certification. Given the number of people who asked me in interviews if I either spoke Spanish or had ESL training, I'm thinking of adding an ESL certificate. In fact, I'm going to sit for the exam in the fall - I believe I can pass it - and that will allow me to obtain certification by examination.

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rivka
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*hug*

Sounds like a good plan. [Smile]

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Alcon
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[Frown] ((Belle)) Good plan though, hang in there. If at first you don't succeed, try try again. And if at first you do succeed, try not to break your jaw when it hits the floor.

I went job posting hunting, and every time I do that I feel like I'm under qualified or like the current work I have to show doesn't nearly represent me well enough. The result is I go on a desperate programming spree trying to get all my various sample websites and programs into a shape I feel I can show off. That's the stage I'm at now. I never finish a project, I always think of more to add to it, so my projects are always in a constant state of development and half completion. Not very pretty to show [Frown]

I think I'm almost ready to apply to a few of them though. There's one that's a game developer position at an MMO company. I didn't particularly set out to be a game developer, but it's the job I feel like I'm most qualified for - what having been developing a Multi-User Dungeon (text based RPG) since I was 16. Wish me luck...

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