posted
From my understanding of Psalm 127, it says that you should have children in your youth:
quote: 3 Sons are a heritage from the LORD , children a reward from him. 4 Like arrows in the hands of a warrior are sons born in one's youth. 5 Blessed is the man whose quiver is full of them. They will not be put to shame when they contend with their enemies in the gate.
And Genisis 3:19 does not mention anything of the sort:
quote: 19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken; for dust you are and to dust you will return."
However, three verses before that, it says two of the three things:
quote: 16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you."
I see no mention of monthly fertility.
I haven't been following your letters...aside from the obvious, is your grandmother "all right"?
Posts: 515 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
I hope you don't take her letters too seriously and can just laugh at them. They are entertaining. Telling you how many kids to have? Man, that is just going too far. And the monthly fertility--dunno where that came from. She scatters "wisdom" and "advice" like candy.
Posts: 7050 | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
And, in the lack of a minister, I am legally allowed to marry you. Not that kind of marry...you know what I mean.
Posts: 515 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think the best part is the contrast between the "have lots of kids" and that women being able to get pregnant every month is a curse.
Um . . .
I guess as someone with three kids, I should be thrilled that it's one of the "best numbers."
And do I have this right? It's good for a woman to go to college (like your cousin's fiancé) but not to have a job (as only the cousin having one is mentioned, and she thinks you should quit yours (I'm completely mystified on the reasoning there))?
As usual, bizarre. And fascinating, rather like a car wreck.
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
I have yet to figure out what is going to happen if the fiancee starts working. I'm assuming they think she will quit as soon as she gets pregnant. I have no idea how quickly they expect her to start popping out babies.
The thought that came to my mind when I heard the story about the proposal meal was "how quaint".
The raw bribery of the vacation house for our honeymoon was interesting. I guess it has never dawned on her that people might NOT want to honeymoon in Ocean City, Maryland.
Oh the 3 and seven thing. Three for the Trinity and 7 for completion like the days of creation.
posted
Oh, and on the bribery side, don't forget the mention of yet ANOTHER honkin' big diamond for a VIRTUOUS WOMAN! <laughs>
Just see what you're missing, AJ!
Who could possibly prefer a job to the curse of having seven children and obeying your husband and ... what was our other curse again? Oh, yeah, getting pregnant every month. (Does she mean having periods, you think?)
I just heard about a book written by an Algerian Army officer, using the pen name of a woman, about some people in Afghanistan. He said he's astonished that U.S. liberals are against the war in Iraq, since the people we are fighting (he means the extreme Islamists) are against everything we in America hold dear. He said that the most horrible societies in the world, those which are the worst to live under, are those which treat women badly. Like Afghanistan. And your grandma's. You are free, AJ. Grandma tried to cast those chains around you but you are free.
posted
Oh, of course, ak! That must be what she meant. She didn't mean a curse, she meant The Curse! *snickers*
Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Banna, I'm serious. Your grandmother sounds slightly screwy, but honestly well-intentioned.
From her point of view, since she does not understand that you are not operating from the same premises she is, your behavior is irrational. Her behavior is irrational to most of Hatrack, because most of Hatrack is not operating on her assumptions.
If the letters really bother you, I'm serious, TELL HER. Tell her you love her, you appreciate the love, but you are not operating on the same premises and you would like to be a member of the family as yourself and not as someone she imagines. It will be hard, but it will be quick, and I really think things will be better after. I don't think she has a bad heart, and she's a grandmother. I promise, she'd rather have part of you than none at all, and I really think if you tell her what's going on, they'll respect that.
It worked with mine. My grandmother was driving me crazy, and I finally told her how much I needed my grandparents love but was simply not going to change my life to fit what they wanted, but please be my grandparents anyway. My dad got used to my brother abandoning the belief system.
*thinks* If anything, they are harder on the people they suspect might still be listening. My baby brother gets a ton more flack than the other two. *grin* What you need to do is kill all hope that you'll ever listen. They love you.
posted
Actually kat, I'm beginning to reach my goal. This letter really didn't bother me in the least. The most annoyed I got was when I was typing it in and doing all the UBB tags because they are a pain. I think that has been my goal, getting to where they don't bother me no matter what she says. It has taken a long time for me to get there, and I may still have relapses. But they shouldn't bother me. I should be able to blow them off as the batty ravings of a loony grandma that means well and is basically harmless.
I'm posting them now more for their sheer entertainment value. I know Tom Davidson rotfls at each one.
posted
Well, if you decide you want to get married, my study's pretty small, but you're welcome to it. Posts: 9866 | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
After a long time, finally I've got around to read this. It's funny, in a sad kind of way. BannaOJ, your grandmother remembers me of one eldery lady whom I teach.
I mean...she's nice and well-meaning, but she does give me a hard time "advising" me about what I should do about my life.
Fortunatelly, my own grandmas are real dolls.
I hope yours can, someday, understand you and the choices you made in your life.
posted
I am reading an Agatha Christie novel, who's name slips my mind.
In it one lady is described as being "Nice and caring and totally selfish. She doesn't realize, in her self-centered world, how much damage she does with her uncalled advice and blind efforts to help."
She reminded me of your grandmother.
Of course, this woman is killed by a, as yet undiscovered, murderer.
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged |
That's why I love Agatha Christie. She has shocking insight into human beings, and can create characters in a sentence. She'd kill at the one-line descriptions thread.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
| IP: Logged |
posted
"Funerals are Fatal"...I don't remember this book...maybe they misnamed it when translating to portuguese. Sometimes they do that...
Posts: 1785 | Registered: Oct 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hmmm, I was looking for the thread where I posted about a conversation I had with my mother. The one where I went back to talking about home equity loans because that was the only sane thing I could talk about. I thought it might be here but it isn't.
posted
I remember reading that, but I don't recall if it was in a thread you started or one that someone else started.
Posts: 957 | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
I've got a couple of grandma doozies lately. The last one used "fornicator" in it. Was fairly innocuous for the first 4 pages to lull you into complacency, and then the last two *WHAM*. I'll have to find it and type it in when I've got time.
posted
I get weekly sermons from my grandmother for not calling her during the week. is she a bad grandma, she says (yes). What if she died in the meantime (what if I died in the meantime?) But so long as I'm living at home, I'm sorta bound on visiting.
Posts: 5700 | Registered: Feb 2002
| IP: Logged |
Wow, Anna. I have to admit after reading the last thread you bumped, I was wondering if the zany hijinks in passive-aggressive attacks had peaked. But it would seem your mother is simply the Obi-Wan to Mamaw's Qui-Gon
The trouble with people like this is that, yes, they do have good intentions-on the surface. Of course they tell themselves, "I only want what's best for my (insert relationship here)!" and in fact they mean it. On the surface.
But when 'what's best for' always includes 'precisely what I say', then that person is lying to you and to themselves. Your grandmother, and your mother, are obviously lying both to you and to themselves, in almost every word they write. They do not intend malice, but it seems obvious to me that it's definitely there, and their only excuse is that they are unaware of it.
It's a piss-poor excuse. This is what happens when people confuse traditions and religion and holiness.
I'm sorry again that you have to deal with this, as others have said, it cannot be easy. For what it's worth, though, I commend your method! You've certainly got a lot of patience and self-discipline. I can tell you that if I were in your situation, the bridges wouldn't just have been burned, they would've been napalmed, nuked, and then rolled over with tractors. Then nuked again.
It really is ironic that you are exhibiting much more Christian characteristics than either your mother or grandmother. They're not exclusively Christian characteristics, of course, but I can't help but laugh at the thought of them laughing at the idea.
Anyway, I ramble. Good work! I'm sorry they keep giving you things to grind your teeth over, but it seems to me you've handled it in a way that does you great credit.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
*hugs Rakeesh* thank you for your kind words. Currently I'm not in the throes of emotional pain that I was when I started this thread. That's not to say that it is easy, but I'm in a much healthier place now than I was then. It's interesting to see how far I've come. Having this as a venting point definitely helps.
posted
Excellent! I'm glad to hear you're able to salvage some serenity out of the whole nasty business. (Of course, the letters make me think, "Serenity now! Serenity now!")
Of course normally I'd say in a thread talking about one's family, "This is a credit to good parenting." But somehow, I think handling well constant parental attacks and viciousness like this in a good and productive way doesn't quite apply Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
| IP: Logged |
posted
Y'know. I want to thank Hatrack for being there with me through the rough patch in my life that this thread documents, and kind of close out the story.
Grandma now has mild dementia. They don't know if it will go into full fledged Alzheimer's or not. I do wonder if some of the nuttiness in these letters was a pre-cursor, I wondered it then but it isn't like my family was going to listen to my opinion on the matter.
My brother got married about a year ago. Grandma was present. She's now 83 or 84 I think. It was actually kind of sad. Now that her 3 daughters *know* that she's literally losing her mind and can't exert control over them, she's ignored until it suits them.
For example: rehersal dinner, they had flown out cross-country that morning, and she had literally been up for about 20 hours, and was complaining she was tired. They all ignored her, until finally one of the son-in-laws pointed it out to them twice, and they finally did get her to a hotel where she could rest.
On the other hand I can't exactly blame them considering how domineering she was over their lives for so long. She has been marginalized, and isn't the center of attention anymore. I admit I didn't take it upon myself to do anything either.
Late last Fall my grandfather moved them into a sort of deluxe retirement resort, that sounds like a cruise ship without the ocean. A bunch of their friends are there as well, and even though her memory is patchy in spots she's still enjoying herself. And, once you get into the place, they will continue to take care of you regardless of your health (they have a hospital-ish wing also) until you die. This is a huge burden off of their kids, and I absolutely applaud my grandfather for having the foresight to make this decision.
AJ
A few other notes: My relationship with my mother has vastly improved in just the past year. I'm much more secure in who I am, and being able to stand up to her. They have changed a lot as my brothers grew up (and are now grown)The double standard applied to them as far as freedom goes (partially because they were Boys and I was a Girl) still grates at times, but I am happy they've come around at all.
Steve and I have been together 8 years now. Nope we aren't married. I've used a phrase of Tom D's several times, where he said once that "We were more committed to *not* getting married, than most people are to being married". Oh and I'm up to 5 corgis at home, and Steve is still tolerating them.
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[No No]](graemlins/nono.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[ROFL]](graemlins/rofl.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
