What are your honest opinions about housewives? I'm not talking stay at home moms; I'm talking about women who instead of working take care of the home. Is their "job" a job that contributes to society?
I'm curious to know this because I've gotten a lot of flack for being a housewife IRL. Though we have children, they are both in school all day, so I'm home alone. I haven't gotten a ton of verbal flack, it's more been odd looks and snippy comments. Example: I was speaking to a friend, and upon hearing that my daughter's new school has an all-day kindergarten, she remarked, "Well, I bet you were glad about that. I'd like to be able to send my kids off all day too." (she homeschools her children) Ummm, the reason we're glad about it is that Operaetta is used to an all-day routine, not because I feel some need to "send her off" all day. I don't think the comment was meant in jest, because this was the latest in a long line of me not having kids at home yet not working outside the home.
A lot of people I've met (not just this one person) seem almost offended that I'm a housewife. Why is this? It seems acceptable to stay at home if you have small children, but not if you have older ones. The only thing I can think of is that my job doesn't count as a "job" for some people. I dunno, but I'm interested to hear what everyone thinks.
posted
I'll admit that I've also wondered about this. I think that if my kids were at school all day, I'd probably get a part-time job. I would think that housework can be done in less time with the kids gone, but I've never tried. Do you feel like being a housewife takes up all your time? Do you feel like what you do matters? If so, I would say don't listen to the naysayers.
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posted
i think it's just as important for you to be home now as when your kids were home all day. it's reassuring for the kids that whatever happens, mom is home and can come to the rescue.
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posted
You are still a mother, even if you're kids aren't home all day. Most mothers I know with kids in school spend their time getting involed in their children's schools, volunteering at the school, and being there when the kids get home to help with homework and such.
Why is that not valuable? Do your kids need to be with you every minute for you to be an at-home mother? I don't think so.
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For the mom thing, I loved having my mom at home, evenwhen we were all old enough to be in school.
I have to admit that when one woman I know was talking about how horribly busy she was, much to busy to read for fun, when she doesn't work, has no children at home, and has a housekeeper, I wanted to roll my eyes.
[ January 20, 2005, 02:30 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
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posted
Okay, what would be considered contributing to society?
Do you need a paycheck to validate work you do?
Perhaps what worries you is the perception of idleness.
Do you think it is earned? If so, how can you change that? If not, then I would just let the comments slide over me like water on a duck's back.
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posted
But I listen to the naysayers because I think their opinion on this is interesting and I don't understand it.
Why would anyone care that I stay home all day? Granted, I'm usually pretty busy (except on the days I give myself off) but I won't lie and say I clean and volunteer every second of the day. But even if I did absolutely *nothing* all day except the minimum amount of housework and spend the rest of the day napping on the couch is it worthy of criticism?
Here's a better metaphor - If I had a job that I just went in and did (but didn't do any extra) no one among my peer group would criticize that much. So I'm thinking maybe the difference really lies in the fact that it's not work outside of the home, and that interests me.
posted
Well, I definitely think that a SAHM with kids in school should be as involved as possible, and that really does take up a lot of time.
But I don't see why you need to be physically at home. You can have a cell phone and still be *there* for your kids. Unless someone brings them home without your knowledge and without calling you, but that's another can of beans.
Space: You have to do what works for your family. If you are all being edified and your husband doesn't mind/likes supporting the family while you stay home, then great.
It's only recently that we've decided that people only have worth when they work every second of the day.
But if there's a serious inbalance of effort going into your family, I mean *serious*, then I could see a possibility for resentment on your husband's part.
posted
As long as you and your spouse agree that you don't need the extra income and they're fine with you not working for pay, I don't see how it's anyone else's business.
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Being a housewife sounds like hard freaking work... Harder work than anything. I don't know why people look down on it. It's silly. I hate that hierarchy nonsense. People should just do their own thing for the most part and ignore the naysayers. Plus, women can't really win. If they work outside the home, they are considered bad mothers, if they don't work, then they get accused of smothering. It really makes no sense...
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I wonder if it is related to the perception that you are allowing yourself to be oppressed because you haven't gone outside the home and gotten a job. Could it be similar to how people feel some scorn for a woman who stays in an abusive relationship?
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I can definately see how this could be true. When the kids are in school, she volunteers. She may be part of the PTA. How much is the housekeeper responsible for? There may be other, perhaps elderly family members to take care of. She may have church obligations. She may do family history. She may be quilting. She pays the bills, grocery shops, takes kids to and from lessons or sports, etc.
And well, reading is harder than watching TV. I think that is why lot of people don't "read for fun". Not because there isn't enough time for leisure, but because they'd rather have more story for the time and so choose watching media over reading.
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posted
Oooh - mph I never thought of that. That's *very* intriguing. I think there is quite a bit of scorn in the comments people have made, so maybe you're on to something there.
Everyone - don't worry that I'm letting people's comments bother me. They annoy me, but they don't make me re-think my decision. I'm just wondering why the attitude I described exists.
quote:does anyone on hatrack hold, or understand, the opinion that being a housewife is a negative thing?
My guess is that most of those who have scorn for housewives would not admit that they see it as a negative thing, possibly not even to themselves.
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posted
Hierarchy I guess. People want to feel smug and above someone... The reverse is true as well. Some women who wrok outside the home might think they are contributing more, housewives might think that moms working outside of the home are selfish. Again, both attitudes are distructive because people are just doing their best either way.
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posted
When the kids are in school, she volunteers. Nope. She may be part of the PTA. Nope. How much is the housekeeper responsible for? Cleans the house from top to bottom once a week. There may be other, perhaps elderly family members to take care of. Nope. Her parents are dead, her husbands parents are healthy and still working. She may have church obligations. Yes - I do beleive she has some church obligations. She may do family history. Nope. She may be quilting. Nope. She pays the bills, grocery shops, For two people, with bills online. takes kids to and from lessons or sports, etc. No kids at home.
She can do whatever she wants, and after a lifetime of raising kids and working, why not? Moaning about how life was just so hectic was pretty risible, though.
[ January 20, 2005, 03:28 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
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posted
There are always attitudes that crop up to give people a sense of superiority. I think it is human nature. And every single one of us does it.
I, for one, disdain people who foolishly deny reality in order to embrace fairytale perceptions. I'm not talking about adhering to philosophical views or opinions. Those are up for debate and such. I'm talking about having the facts before them, and still denying them or doing nothing about them because they'd rather it not be true.
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posted
PSI, just saw your edit. I would definately agree that the situation could leave room for resentment if both husband and wife aren't on board.
Luckily, Mr. Opera and I are. I don't take advantage of him by not doing my "job" at home, and he doesn't take advantage of me by doing absolutely nothing at home or working longer hours because I'm always there.
I think people's opinions on housewives (or SAHMs with older children as Belle pointed out ) are interesting because the criticism doesn't stem from the same cause as the working mom/SAHM debate. There's no resentment over whether the kids are in daycare or at home...it's something different altogether.
posted
Well, then... I guess that rather than simply owning up to the fact that she doesn't really like to read for pleasure (because it is a commendable vice) she just says she doesn't have time. Because reading addicts make time, even when there isn't
But once a week cleaning leaves cooking, laundry, clutter, etc. Obligations to friends, making appearances at the country club. Probably getting her hair done every week or more. Her nails. Must keep her clothes in season...
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posted
I guess I can't see a problem with someone choosing to do this, Space. I know that I, personally, get very irked when women I know who don't have much to do compare themselves to me. That's different. I probably inadvertantly pass that annoyance onto people who don't deserve it, such as yourself.
One girl I know has been married a total of two months, has absolutely nothing to do except clean a one-bedroom apartment, and constantly tries to compare her housecleaning to mine. She says things like, "I know my husband will always stay with me because *I* never miss a meal when I'm cooking for him." I have to bite my tongue to keep from pointing out that the reason her dinner is always done is because she has eight hours to prepare it everyday.
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quote: "Well, I bet you were glad about that. I'd like to be able to send my kids off all day too." (she homeschools her children)
OK, I know this is not the real topic, but it stuck out to me. Why is this woman homeschooling? Why not send her kids to school?
But on topic- Opera, as some one said you can't win. Your kids do need you- whether to volunteer in their classroom, pick themup if they get sick, not have to make back up arrangements for holidays..and you can help with homework, take them to activies, etc with less worry about he housework, etc. Why would anyone say they need you less now????
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quote:"I know my husband will always stay with me because *I* never miss a meal when I'm cooking for him."
I swear statements like this is one of the reasons I'm not married. I'll slit my wrists before I give someone so much power over me and count myself as worth so little that I believe their continued condescension is only secured by a well-cooked pot roast.
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posted
Not to mention the fact that it isn't true and doesn't work that way. She's in happy-happy land right now. What can I say.
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posted
Speaking of pot roast, I threw one in the crock pot this morning and it is tormenting me. It smells so incredibly good I want to eat it right NOW.
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Put it in the crock pot, and veggies and some water or a can of soda pop (sprite, dr pepper, coke) salt, pepper, garlic, any other spices that smell good at the time. Add an apple (don't eat it after it is cooked it doesn't taste good). Lemon juice, balsamic vinegar, some olive oil and cook it all day.
There is nothing wrong with a stay at home mom who has kids in school. My mom was home when we got home and the few times that she wasn't I remember sitting out on the steps crying because she wasn't there. If you can do it more power to you.
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You know, I bet if a wife gets herself taken care of during the day, ie plenty of rest and some recreation, it's a lot easier to let her husband do the same when he gets home.
Like, if you are well-rested/content, you can take care of all the hassles when hubby gets home and make sure he gets a break from *his* work.
I'm hitting upon something very important here.
edit: Like, you know, if a woman works herself to death before the husband gets home, she kinda hopes that when he gets home he'll let her relax a bit or entertain her or amuse her some? Like, some women (probably me included) see the time when hubby gets home as a time to get her needs met, as far as adult interaction and relaxation are concerned. (Not that other, dirtier thing.)
But, not so for the woman who can take a break during the day! She has had her turn, and she can let the hubby have his turn to rest too. It probably takes some stress off of him if he knows he isn't going to be expected to amuse the family when he gets home from work.
posted
Both my parents are retired and they are both incredibly busy every day. I keep telling them they need a vacation from their retirement.
Kat, you really need to open your mind a little. I mean, you have a full-time job, but manage to post here, what, over 16,000 times in less than 5 years? Just under your Katharina name alone.
How busy could you be at work? People at McDonald's, who actually work for a living, certainly don't have time to surf the web all day. Not only do you make better money, but you get to goof around while doing it.
I'm just saying, you might consider that the woman is actually busy. She may not be busy in a way you think is productive, but it may seem to her that you aren't working in a productive way either, if you have a full-time job and manage to spend time reading fiction, going to church, grocery shopping and other normal things, not to mention all the things she's doing that she thinks are important and still spend the majority of your day at hatrack. It's just a thought.
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(Although I am one of those people who can always find or invent something to do, and I really hate the sight of people relaxing)
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posted
I do that too. For someone who is so inherently lazy, I sure can come up with a thousand projects for myself to take up all my time.
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posted
Bite me, Kayla. I never talked about myself in my posts above, and I didn't make it personal to you. There's no reason or cause for you to turn personally insulting to me.
I know exactly what my own life is like, and I'm not complaining at all. I like it. I enjoy the freedom I get at work - I get everything done by the deadlines, and I can apportion my time as I want. I like my job and my life, and I am as busy as I want to be.
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posted
Coming from a background of having both parents at home, all day, every day, while growing up, I think having a SAHP is an awesome way to raise children and make a home. Goodness knows, there was an enormous amount of security and luxury in my life that I took for granted.
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"But even if I did absolutely *nothing* all day except the minimum amount of housework and spend the rest of the day napping on the couch is it worthy of criticism?"
Yes. Because I've been a househusband. I've also lived alone. And keeping a house is not that hard. It's not a full-time job.
If this would be the extent of your contribution to the household, you would indeed be open to criticism insofar as you would not be legitimately pulling your own weight.
Whether "pulling your own weight" is a value that we need to enforce in this society is another issue. But most of the arguments I've seen that make the case for housewife as a respected profession also assume childcare; if you remove the childcare from the equation, it's not as easy of a lifestyle to justify.
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posted
Have you even considered the possiblibity that she is exactly as busy as she wants to be? You're the one who wanted to roll her eyes at this poor woman. What's with that?
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Brown the outside of the roast in a hot skillet with oil. Dump it in the crock pot. Dump a can of cream of mushroom soup on it. Dump a packet of dry onion soup over that. Put the lid on and cook on low all day.
I hope today's roast will be as good. I am thinking I'll garnish with french fried onions (from a can) and gravy (from a mix). Au gratin potatoes (also from a box) and fresh steamed broccoli to bring it all together.
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posted
Well, Tom, shoot all the country club wives right now. And those who inherited money. I mean, they aren't contributing to society.
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posted
I'm not rolling my eyes because I don't think she's busy. I'm rolling my eyes that the reason she doesn't read books is because she's far too busy. It's buying a Mercedes and then saying the reason the you don't collect local art is because you're too poor. I completely believe that there's no money for that cause, but it's for other reasons than poverty.
Which is what I said in my post. Read more carefully before you get insulting.
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posted
Now I'm craving pot roast, which I rarely have anymore (mad cow, y'know, and organic beef is so expensive). I brown mine, put it in the pot with about 1/3 a bottle red wine, carrots, celery, tons of garlic, bouquet garni....remove meat before serving and puree all the veggies and liquid, serve meat with polenta or risotto, with the sauce.
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posted
I'm guessing that Tom would not so much be arguing for "shooting" them as for "not being obligated to praise" them. I can see that. Still, I think it is (and should be) a family's choice, insofar as possible. Priorities will differ, and individual stories are always more complicated than they look from outside.
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm guessing that Tom would so much be for "shooting" them as "not being obligated to praise" them
I'm guessing you meant to put he word "not" in there..but it's a bit funnier this way.
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posted
Tom, respectfully, you might have been a househusband, but you weren't one with kids. While I earnestly believe that children are a blessing, they are also a lot of work. They add a lot to household management, even when they aren't home. The laundry alone is two to three times as much. The floor has to be vacuumed twice as often (if not more so). And so on.
And PSI, I think you're 100% right...when there is someone home to take care of the household management (and get his/her breaks during the day), it leaves the other spouse a lot more room to relax and take a break in the evening for a little while. I think it allows the family to have time to be a family...to build the relationships closer and really know each other better.
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) are interesting because the criticism doesn't stem from the same cause as the working mom/SAHM debate. There's no resentment over whether the kids are in daycare or at home...it's something different altogether.![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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