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Author Topic: Glee Season 2
aeolusdallas
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I was glad that Rachel got dressed down for her behavior. I also loved that it pointed out that many of kurt's issues are internal and that Dalton Academy was safe but also a gilded cage.

The music was all absolutely amazing.

The whole Puck/Wrestler girl 7 minutes in heaven exchange and Santana's reaction shot was great.

And boy oh boy can Mike and Brittany dance!!

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Geraine
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I think I said "Whoa" about 5 times while they were dancing. Not only were they great, but Brittany did that entire dance in heels. I can't imagine what her feet felt like after that scene was finished.
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Lyrhawn
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I absolutely loved the dance number between Mike and Brittany. Reminded me of all the great dance numbers from the 30s, 40s, and 50s before that genre really died out. And all the women back then danced with heels. It's insanely impressive.

I liked that Puck took a stand for his and Finn's friendship by pushing Rachel away. But man, what an insanely awful, awful person. Rachel just floors me. I loved the interplay between her and Kurt, and I loved that Kurt got a chance to realize that maybe New Directions wasn't so bad after all, and that he's had to make the choice between a contest of individualities and the safety of anonymity. The choice isn't nearly as clear-cut as he thought it was.

Rachel though, geez, the fact that she thinks she was justified, or gets some kind of mulligan...I serious think that this episode takes us into a place where Rachel isn't just a selfish brat...there's actually something seriously wrong with her. Her petulant selfishness when she was denied a solo was just he tip of the iceberg. I dislike how the episode made me like and hate her at once. But I like that it actually made me like Kurt for once, who I usually can't stand.

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dabbler
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Florence and the Machine (the original of the final song) has been really on the radar these last few months. Heard her a bunch on the radio, on SYTYCD over the summer, now Glee. Very captivating voice.
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katharina
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None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.

The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.

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Lisa
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Kurt is the creator's Mary Sue. You can't expect more.
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Lyrhawn
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quote:
Originally posted by katharina:
None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.

The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.

It's not even that. It utterly fails because Kurt is such a jerk so often. If he were only the victim, I could see it. But he's often either a bully, albeit not a violent one, or just a completely unlikable self-involved jerk.

That scene with him and Rachel this week was the first time I've liked either of them in awhile. And I liked them throughout the episode until the end, when I hated Rachel. But Kurt seems to have actually learned something, so I liked that too.

I don't get why they can't make every episode like that for at least one of the characters, while still holding onto a shred of continuity.

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Lyrhawn
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And another thing.

I thought "Don't Cry for me Argentina" was a great song for Rachel (Kurt did a nice job, but doesn't really have the punch that the song needs).

But they wasted it. It would have been a great song for Rachel to sing at the end of an episode where she realized she was being a total jerk to the club, and sang it as an apology to them. Instead she sings it to no one while pouting about why she can't get her way, and then proceeds to do even WORSE things in the aftermath.

This just goes to show that the best episodes, so far as the music goes, are when the music either perfectly matches what's happening on stage, or is used as a background piece just for fun while letting the story tell itself.

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katharina
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They seem to have confused "downtrodden" with "sociopath". It's really frustrating.

I can just imagine if the pitch matched the show actually is: "Every character is either a horrible person or flat as a pancake, while the character that gets showered with praise on a weekly basis is based on me! How I wish my life was! Only hotter!"

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AvidReader
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quote:
Originally posted by Lyrhawn:
I serious think that this episode takes us into a place where Rachel isn't just a selfish brat...there's actually something seriously wrong with her.

She did once announce that she's like Tinkerbell; she needs applause to live.

I don't know. I'm not sure I see a teenager fooling around with another guy as quite as big a deal. This is not a mature woman who did this to her husband. This is a dumb kid in her first real relationship trying to "get even" because she got her feelings hurt. Discovering that there are consequences to making yourself feel better is an important life lesson that will serve her well down the road.

The part I'm confused about is why a girl with two doting parents has such intense abandonment issues. That exchange with Finn? "You said you'd never leave me!" That's an abandonment issue talking. (Yeah, been there, done that.) Maybe the writer's got that problem and doesn't realize people with both parents tend not to do that. It's just weird.

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katharina
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I understand the abandonment issue - her mother just dropped her cold because she wasn't a cute little baby anymore last year. That would give anyone a complex.

I'm still shocked that happened. A mother searches a daughter that looks exactly like her, sings like an angel, longs for any kind of relationship, and she walks on her for not being 7 lb.? That part was bad plotting. But Rachel being damaged by it is completely understandable.

I mean, it isn't like Rachel hunted her down. The mother hunted down Rachel, and then was so disappointed with who she found she disappeared and adopted the child of the blonde, perfect cheerleader instead. That is COLD.

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Raymond Arnold
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quote:
I understand the abandonment issue - her mother just dropped her cold because she wasn't a cute little baby anymore last year. That would give anyone a complex.
Wait what? I missed some episodes last year, I totally missed that.
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katharina
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At the end of last season, her mother orchestrted events to find her daughter, they sang a few inappropriate songs together, and then the mother didn't want a relationship with Rachel because what she really wanted was Rachel as a baby. As a teenager, she was no fun at all. So she has no contact with Rachel and adopted Quinn's baby.

As horrible as everyone else is, she definitely wins forever as Worst Person On the Show. I can't even imagine the magnitude of Rachel's abandonment issues, all justified.

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Geraine
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I just realized that Quinn's baby is technically Rachel's adopted sister...

I hope the writers will start writing Rachel as being a little more mature. I actually think she is less mature this season than she was the second half of the first season.

As far as character development goes I think the only real winners on the show have been Quinn and (to a lesser extent) Kurt.

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Raymond Arnold
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I thought Rachel was supposed to have two gay dads. Was it too gay moms, or did I totally get that wrong?

Was Rachel actually likeable in that episode?

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katharina
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...creating a child requires a mother as well as a father.

Rachel was likable there - I liked Rachel most of last season. The duet of "Poker Face" was a little bizarre, but mostly it made sense and Rachel was very relatable. Even when she had faults, they were human ones. This year is nothing sociopaths, cartoons, and Mary Sues.

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aeolusdallas
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quote:
Originally posted by katharina:
None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.

The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.

Nothing in that episode sanctified Kurt.
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aeolusdallas
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Katharina you need to learn the actual meaning of sociopath so you quit misusing it.
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Hank
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quote:
Originally posted by Raymond Arnold:
I thought Rachel was supposed to have two gay dads. Was it too gay moms, or did I totally get that wrong?

Was Rachel actually likeable in that episode?

She was raised by her two gay dads. The mother was her the surrogate they used--her birth mother, played by Idina Menzel.
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msquared
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Coach is now my second favorite character.

msquared

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Raymond Arnold
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Christmas episode was excellent. Funny and touching in all the right ways.
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Lyrhawn
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I hated the fact that Rachel was singing "Last Christmas" to Finn. It would have made perfect sense for HIM to sing it, but zero sense for her.

And what the heck is wrong with the kids at that school? I would have loved for carolers as good as them to swing by my class in high school.

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AvidReader
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The rest of the school is pathalogical in their need to hate the Glee club. It's like a mountain range or a lake - just part of the setting.

But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!

As for the Finn/Rachel stuff, I was screaming at him to stay away from the narcissist. He can do better. [Smile]

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Shanna
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My choir used to carol during the holidays as a fundraiser (we also did singing-grams for Valentines.) I haven't met a high schooler who wouldn't welcome a break from class, any kind of break. But the writers dictate that students at McKinley would loudly insult cheerleaders and football players at the top of the popularity pyramid just for being in show choir. And teachers can throw shoes without reprimand.

I adored the whole Brittany/Santa storyline. I really watch the show just for her most weeks. And the ending, while ridiculous, was super sweet!

Sue as the Grinch was also quite fun. But everything else, especially the music, felt forced. The song while decorating the tree, Rachel's boring solo, Rachel singing that horrible choice with Finn, and Kurt and Blaine's duet while cute also felt like it was dropped in as a necessity.

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Amanecer
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quote:
But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!
Hear Hear! I loved the Grinch story.
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Raymond Arnold
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I loved the decorating the tree song - I was totally not expecting them to sing "Isle of Misfit Toys" and it made my day. Apart from the Rachel songs I really liked their choices.
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Geraine
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I liked the episode as well. I've decided that Coach Beist is probably the only truly good hearted character on that show. I liked how she opened up to Brittany, and I admit I teared up when Beist was outside the choir room looking at Artie when he tried his new legs she got him.

I still hate Rachel. I hope Finn doesn't get back with her. At the end when they were near the tree he had that half smile on his face when he looked at her. I hope it doesn't grow into something more.

I actually liked Kurt and Blaine's duet. I thought it was very well done.

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aeolusdallas
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quote:
Originally posted by Amanecer:
quote:
But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!
Hear Hear! I loved the Grinch story.
I loved this episode and I was practically doubled over with laughter during the Grinch scenes. Plus Bieste made me tear up at the end.

Plus that rendition of "Baby it's Cold Outside" was absolutely beautiful.

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Phanto
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This episode touched my heart. The football coach is a very relatable person.

That said, the writers have pretty much decided Rachel is just going to be an unlikeable character.

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Lyrhawn
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Really liked last week's episode.

And I think the Warbler number are the best thing, musically, going for the show right now.

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Raymond Arnold
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I just saw that today as well, and thought it was pretty good.
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aeolusdallas
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I like that Rachael is growing up. I also like that Quinn pointed out Finn's hypocrisy in going after her. Even Finn seems to have finally started to wise up about his motives. Another great thing was Blaine's hilarious mishandling of his crush. It makes him less perfect and humanizes him. Kurt had some really great double takes, quips and expressions during that debacle.

Santana's dressing down by the group was a long time coming and wow that fight with Zizes was the most fun I have had watching TV in some time.

I am loving Zizes a lot. I am glad they are showing us a girl who has some self respect. Particularly a big girl who people also assume will be "grateful" if any boy tries and gets some from them.

Clearly Puck is liking it as well. It's good that he meets a girl who wont fall for his bad boy act.

Plus the Music was pretty good.

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Lyrhawn
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I agree with everything you just said.
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Geraine
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I'm pretty happy about Zizes being in the group as well. Seeing Puck go after her was my favorite part of the episode. I thought it was great that Puck got stood up, especially since he is usually the one doing it.

I'm probably one of the only people that think Finn and Quinn are a cuter couple than any of the others. I think they have great chemistry. I never understood the whole Finn / Rachel thing. At the end of the episode Santana looked back at Sam and smiled and gave him a look, I'm wondering if she is going to try to hook up with him.

I am pretty happy about Kurt finally telling Blaine about his feelings for him. I had to go back and watch "When Harry met Sally" again to understand what they were talking about though.

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aeolusdallas
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Wow they knocked Sing!(My chemical Romance) out of the park!

That scene at the Batmitzvah was hilarious. They made great fun of the whole Bieber Fever phenomenon and still did good versions of the songs. I really thought the Diva-off was a great number as well. Plus Zizes number was fun. Really we had a whole lot of music in this episode. All of it pretty well done.

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Geraine
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I don't know how I feel about the whole Quinn / Sam situation. I kind of feel bad for both of them.

I really liked the scene at the hospital as well when Will took Sue to see the kids.

The whole Puck and Lauren thing just makes me smile. She is in control and Puck is digging it.

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aeolusdallas
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I loved Brittany's statement to Rachael.
"They look at you and they see a cat getting its temperature taken. And then they hear it screaming."

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Phanto
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Yes, I liked the Brittany trend setting thing as well. Cute subplot.
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Lyrhawn
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I think Lauren's number is troubling if we're to believe she's actually a good singer. That song was pretty flat, and while I thought it was very entertaining, it seems proof that she doesn't have a great voice. Otherwise it was a bit of a silly number to start with.
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aeolusdallas
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The original version of the song is kind of flat too
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Lyrhawn
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Precisely. I meant they specifically chose a song that requires no singing ability.
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aeolusdallas
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Well the actress claims she can sing and had to audition so I will reserve judgement till I hear her again.
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Raymond Arnold
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I'm interested in them doing an original song for their anthem. But I also just saw the video for Pink's Raise your Glass for the first time and think that would make an absolutely amazing anthem for Glee.
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Lyrhawn
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Well we've known for awhile that they were going to do an original music episode, and that some of the best current song writers were lining up to write for the show, including Dianne Warren, who got a shout-out last week via Santana.

It'll be interesting.

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Lyrhawn
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Oh geez, annoying, pity-me-Kurt is back.
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aeolusdallas
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I loved Weepy Drunk Santana!

All of the songs were good but the Human League duet with Blaine and Rachael was particularly good.

Kurt was a stand in for the "There are no bisexuals" guy that will inevitably run into if you spend any real time In a gayborhood. As for his pity me mode, it's just part of his character. He is a drama queen. Just like Rachael.

I actually liked that his father put him in his place.

On a final note...or two. I am so glad we finally got Beiste singing and the long awaited Brittany Ke$ha number.

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Lyrhawn
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I think my biggest problem with Kurt is that he's making a farce out of a genuine problem. you know, I was on his side when Karofsky at school was being a brutal nightmare to him. That was unacceptable, and it happens too often. It shined an important light on the subject.

But every other thing he's done has involved him blaming EVERYone around him for being homophobic because that don't do what he wants. Finn is homophobic because he's a straight guy who doesn't want to be leered at. His dad tells him it's inappropriate to have a sleepover with a potential sexual partner, and it's because he's being gay singled out when clearly that wasn't his dad's concern. And frankly, I think his dad was pretty cool about it. It's impossible to take any of his complaints seriously.

And by the way, Heather Morris is the hottest thing on that show. She absolutely nailed it. Surprisingly, she's one of the better singers in the group, and with the dance moves, I think she comes off as one of the top individual entertainers of the show.

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aeolusdallas
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Kurt's overly defensive. But considering that he is a very flamboyant gay teen in a smallish town in Ohio. The only out gay that he really ever knew till he met Blaine. I can't really fault him to much for it. Plus while his actions towards Finn were not appropriate in real life, had his character been straight no one would have said anything about it. Every teen in a romantic comedy goes to outlandish levels that would be stalking in real life.

As for "creepy". Falling for someone who will never love you back and making a play for them anyways is foolish and doomed from the start but not creepy.

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Lyrhawn
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Well that's a silly hypothetical. If he wasn't gay, he wouldn't have been leering at Finn.

And I think he went beyond your description. It WAS creepy. Maybe even abusive. If Finn had been a girl, we'd be calling Kurt a sexual predator.

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Raymond Arnold
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I think aeolusdallas is somewhat correct that since this is a romantic comedy, it's a bit more accepted for people to do ridiculous things. I think Kurt's actions with Finn are still unacceptable, but I admit that I'd tolerate a wider range of unacceptable things on a silly TV show than I would in real life.
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