quote:Another thing I had a problem with was the male terminator ripping apart that bank vault door. It doesn't matter how much force the dude could generate (although this alone is troubling, those things are solid steel), he wouldn't have the leverage required to do it. If he hit the door as hard as he did, he'd be thrown back 100 feet by his own strength.
These are the kinds of things that you'll just have to get over if you're gonna enjoy most super-strength including movies, heh.
I mean, the last film I can recall that even made a nod in that direction was Spider-man 2 with Doc Ock using his extra limbs to stabilize himself when flinging cars and stuff.
Posts: 17164 | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:I mean, the last film I can recall that even made a nod in that direction was Spider-man 2 with Doc Ock using his extra limbs to stabilize himself when flinging cars and stuff.
And even so, the way he used those arms would have torn them out of his spinal cord long before he ever got to use them for feats of strength.
Posts: 4313 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Comic books are one thing. Heck, I have 200+ Incredible Hulk comics. I expect more from a Terminator property when it comes to realism. Perhaps it was because I was still a kid when I first saw them, but I don't remember any really gross violations of the laws of physics in the first two movies (setting aside the actual time travel of course). I could probably think of some, but since T2 was about the most entertaining movie I've ever seen (and still holds up incredibly well), I guess my brain is otherwise occupied when I watch.
Speaking of the Hulk, ripping apart that bank vault door could only have been done by a character with Incredible Hulk strength, and even then it wouldn't be easy. The terminators are strong, sure, but they can't come close generating the ENORMOUS amount of force that this terminator was doing easily.
Posts: 5656 | Registered: Oct 1999
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Consider the nigh impossible power supply and complicated technology it would take for a humanoid robot to move in a normal baseline human manner (let alone handle anything. Let alone not wear out -very- quickly) and the entire concept becomes even more incredible. Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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Yeah, certainly, but a lot less incredible when you imagine the technological breakthroughs possible with super-intelligent machines inventing other super-intelligent machines in the future.
Posts: 5656 | Registered: Oct 1999
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quote:Originally posted by Xavier: Yeah, certainly, but a lot less incredible when you imagine the technological breakthroughs possible with super-intelligent machines inventing other super-intelligent machines in the future.
"It's a lot less incredible when you accept the magic beans!"
We do have humanoid robots. And they're working on getting them to play sports, dance, the whole deal. But they're still a long way off from doing so in a way that doesn't fall right into the uncanny valley. Let alone in a way that gives them super-human sentience. Just sayin'.
Posts: 6689 | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I mean, the last film I can recall that even made a nod in that direction was Spider-man 2 with Doc Ock using his extra limbs to stabilize himself when flinging cars and stuff. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There was also the latest superman movie when he rips the wing off the plane trying to get it to stop spinning, then when he finally stops it, the nose bends in from the inertia+the weight of the plane. (Yet it didn't rip in half when he set it down.)
I liked the pilot and felt it went by too quickly. I'm looking forward to tonight.
Though, I too, groaned when the chair stopped the bullets. At least, until the explanation came by in the next scene. I suppose if she can have guns hidden in the walls she can make Kevlar furniture.
I don't like the new Sarah though. She's probably the weakest link thus far. Hopefully she'll grow on me (like the new bionic woman did.)
Anyway as to all of the unrealistic stuff... "Repeat to yourself it's just a show I should really just relax."
Posts: 7085 | Registered: Apr 2001
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quote: We do have humanoid robots. And they're working on getting them to play sports, dance, the whole deal. But they're still a long way off from doing so in a way that doesn't fall right into the uncanny valley.
If you remember from T1, they did mention that the first generation of humanoid Terminators were not very convincing.
They got better at making them. Consider how much better we are at making them than we were 20 years ago. Apply that exponential curve to another 20 years. Now imagine that same curve, where one or more super-intelligent program is doing the research and development, with an unlimited budget. This is the same super-intelligence which discovered how to send objects back in time (humans only did it by stealing the technology), so you gotta imagine that technological advancements are within its scope.
quote:"It's a lot less incredible when you accept the magic beans!"
When the basic premise of the show is that magic beans exist, then it seems silly to complain about the existence of magic beans. I see no reason to not complain about other things which are not related to the basic "magic beans exist" indulgence, however.
posted
I just wanted to slap John in the face in the middle of the second episode.
**************** Mini Spoiler ****************
I might have a little more sympathy for him leaving the house if he wasn't being chased by terminators.
Posts: 1327 | Registered: Aug 2007
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I'm liking the show (and the posters, if anyone remembers the OP). It has all of the first-episode problems (whiny characters, bad dialogue, strange story problems) but the basic ability to sort them out. Everyone already knows the backstories, so no time needs to be wasted on that.
This is a good show that Fox may not cancel.
Posts: 684 | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Xavier: My biggest complaint in the third movie was the whiny useless snot version of John Conner. The John Conner is T2 could have wiped the floor with the John Conner in T3. I hated Nick Staal's version. I am more fit to lead an army than his character was.
I just watched the first part. This part struck me, you're quite right but it actually is worse IMO. Basically every character has been gimped. Linda Hamilton's Sarah could twist this pretty new one into a knot. The T2 Connor would punch this one in the nose and take his stuff. Cameron is cute but stylistically more comparable to one of BSG's humanoid Cylons rather than Arnold's unstoppable steamroller. Even the "enemy" Terminators are rather undaunting, if only to match. (all these comments are based on the vibe that the actors give off obviously, rather than as a prediction of how they'll act later)
But, eh. Nothing else seems to be on and it was passably enjoyable, might as well stick around until Fox cancels it Posts: 7593 | Registered: Sep 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Chris Bridges: "Please remain calm."
She nailed that line.
That and when she cut off that guys laughing with her own and stopped as soon as he stopped and just sauntered off, brilliant!
I like the show, but I'm just not feeling the constant sense of impending doom that the movies have. Maybe it's the music or the way it's shot. When they went to the bank for example, they KNEW a terminator was hot on their heels and they weren't even looking around, they just walked and stared straight ahead.
With how much both Connors have been through, I'd be EXTREMELY paranoid and VERY aware of my surroundings.
Also, is John completely unable to handle a firearm? Or is his mom afraid he'll be to brazen if he is confident in the use of weapons? I can't recall one instance in Terminator 1 or 2 where he uses a gun. I know he uses a Kalashnikov in 3 but I pretend 3 didn't happen.
As for terminators pulling off bank vault doors. Apparently they are completely bullet proof, AND they can fall 30+ feet onto the pavement and suffer no indentations in their skeletal structure. This leads me to believe they are made of some sort of super metal alloy; it's darn near indestructible. Bearing that in mind, their feats of super strength do not bother me.
I also didn't like in the pilot episode where the terminator corners John between two cars, points his gun, waits for him to look up, makes an expression, then gets hit by Cameron driving a truck.
What was the point of waiting period? Terminators don't feel the need to gloat, or mutter one liners, unless your Arnold in which case you learn to by talking to John.
It just bothers me that they setup these scenarios where the Terminators are THIS close to killing their target but because they feel the need to look good as they fire the shot they hesitate one moment too long. You can be sure that if a Terminator fires without hesitation, like when he fired at John in the classroom he will not be hitting his target.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:I mean, the last film I can recall that even made a nod in that direction was Spider-man 2 with Doc Ock using his extra limbs to stabilize himself when flinging cars and stuff.
And even so, the way he used those arms would have torn them out of his spinal cord long before he ever got to use them for feats of strength.
Go watch Ghost in the Shell again you big baby.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Also, is John completely unable to handle a firearm? Or is his mom afraid he'll be to brazen if he is confident in the use of weapons? I can't recall one instance in Terminator 1 or 2 where he uses a gun.
John had clearly been trained to reload clips of ammunition in T2. With all the other skills Sarah and his mentors taught him, shooting a gun would be a no-brainer. Sarah basically chose boyfriends by what they could teach John that would be useful when he became a military commander. One of those boyfriends taught her how to shoot, and clearly they would have done the same for John.
Posts: 5656 | Registered: Oct 1999
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posted
Something that bothered me in the second episode
*spoilerish*
Why did the terminator head from the bank vault make it through the portal into the future? It didn't have the skin covering it...and I thought that was a requirement for time travel.
Also, who was that EMT that John went to see? I definitely missed something there.
Posts: 1901 | Registered: May 2004
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posted
I assumed that the head just remained there for the eight years or so that they traveled into the future. The old terminator was blown up by that gun that Sarah used (of course, why it wasn't noticed after the explosion is beyond me. maybe the whole bank exploded).
The EMT was the man at the beginning of the first episode that Sarah Connor was tempted to marry. They had been together for 2 years IIRC.
Posts: 1327 | Registered: Aug 2007
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Maybe I was wrong about the head...I just got the feeling that it came through with them in the explosion because it just activated now.
I also thought it was cheesy that the head could control the body wirelessly. What does the body need the head for if it can move around and kill people on its own when the head isn't anywhere close by.
Posts: 1901 | Registered: May 2004
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posted
I'm watching episode 2 on DVR, but the sound sync is off, which is kind of ticking me off... any way to fix that?
Posts: 2705 | Registered: Sep 2006
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The head clearly pops off the body and flies into the portal when she fired that gun. It traveled with them into the future while the body apparently sat in a dump.
The head activated the next day after the garbage collector took it home and then the body, which had been sitting at the dump for 9 years reactivated.
I also agree it's alittle strange the body can do so much without a head. Of course we are assuming the only CPU and Optical sensor devices are in the head.
edit: Are you guys sure skin is a REQUIREMENT to be sent back in time, or is it more you can't take anything with you besides the skin and whatever else is under it?
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
As established in the movies, whatever goes back has to be enclosed in something living. Which makes this a fairly glaring problem, unless the head still had skin on it when it flew in the portal but managed to lose it all before it landed.
Also kinda unlikely that a Terminator body would just get dumped at a junkyard after being found on the scene of a bank robbery/explosion that apparently included 4 fatalities.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Chris Bridges: As established in the movies, whatever goes back has to be enclosed in something living. Which makes this a fairly glaring problem, unless the head still had skin on it when it flew in the portal but managed to lose it all before it landed.
Also kinda unlikely that a Terminator body would just get dumped at a junkyard after being found on the scene of a bank robbery/explosion that apparently included 4 fatalities.
Not all criminal investigations are conducted equally. I can see a sloppy investigation simply throwing the terminator bits in the dump along with the pieces of the vault, and the terminator reassembling his body upon activation.
But I agree the head thing is a bit questionable.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
A bank robbery that involved 4 deaths and a bank vault door with fingermarks in the metal? I think that would be investigated pretty darn thoroughly, especially since the FBI had an interest.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Chris Bridges: A bank robbery that involved 4 deaths and a bank vault door with fingermarks in the metal? I think that would be investigated pretty darn thoroughly, especially since the FBI had an interest.
4 deaths with NO forensic evidence left behind. The case would very quickly go cold, and clean up would ensue. Also I am not sure Terminators have individual finger prints on their fingers.
Law enforcement on occassion do simply report a lame conclusion and hope it all goes away when faced with a complete lack of solid evidence.
Posts: 14316 | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
also, the terminators are supposed to be very heavy...you would think moving the body would be a big deal, and hard to miss.
At the very least it would make people wonder. Though my biggest problem is the fact that the head made it through the portal.
Also, it doesn't make sense that all terminators wouldn't be programed with John Connors face. He is the leader of the resistance, you would think every terminator would be programmed with his face and orders to kill just in case they ran across him somewhere out of the ordinary. In T3 the terminator did not expect to see John, but when she ran across him, she sure didn't waste any time trying to kill him. Granted, she was from further in the future...but still even the old terminators could be programed with his picture.
I still find it to be an interesting show, even if it doesn't follow the terminator rules. I doubt it would have survived without the strike limiting other options, but it is entertaining enough to hold my interest during the strike.
Besides, I'm in love with Summer Glau
Posts: 1901 | Registered: May 2004
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posted
Super-strong robots aren't that jarring to me as long as they're from sufficiently far in the future. Who knows what kind of metals or stabilizing force fields man (or intelligent robots) could have by then?
Posts: 781 | Registered: Apr 2005
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posted
Lupus, it may be the ultrasonic sounds of the high-capacity servomotors that make dogs bark at the terminators. Probably hurts their ears.
Yes, Summer Glau steals the show. She is also showing real subtlety in her expressions and manner--good acting ability. And it is good to see River is still kicking butt!
Posts: 3742 | Registered: Dec 2001
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quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: 4 deaths with NO forensic evidence left behind. The case would very quickly go cold, and clean up would ensue. Also I am not sure Terminators have individual finger prints on their fingers.
I dunno. Four deaths, a bunch of wacky equipment that looks like a gun and some pretty simultaneously advanced and retro computer equipment (assuming that stuff did not self-destruct), at least four witnesses, and fingerprints from the two humans in the vault. I dunno... it seems to stretch plausibility.
Edit to add: Only watched the first part so far...
Posts: 7593 | Registered: Sep 2006
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posted
Doesn't the bubble that contains the time portal destroy any non-living, non-encased material? I think I remember part of the rear of a semi-truck trailer disappearing when a time portal appeared in the first movie.
If the portal in the bank vault were big enough, it could have destroyed any evidence of the machine that made it (and the terminater head, to nitpick).
But then that leaves a large area of nothing in the vault where something used to be. Of course that means no evidence either, so the investigation could very likely go cold anyway, even if the crime scene was very strange.
Posts: 684 | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
I said fingermarks, not finger prints. A hand-shaped gouge in a reinforced steel vault door might raise some eyebrows.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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Nice touch: John Connor walks up to a modern computer and screws up. I hate shows where a character can walk up to a computer system X (where X is from the future/alien/past) and immediately start hacking into it and using it as if they were experts at it.
Posts: 7593 | Registered: Sep 2006
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quote:I like the show, but I'm just not feeling the constant sense of impending doom that the movies have.
Perfectly put. I really dislike this show. For all of the reasons mentioned above, but mostly because these people (Sarah, John, and T) aren't pulling it off. I'm not sure what I expected, this isn't it though. It doesn't help that I am die hard Terminator fan. In my opinion, they should have followed the books. For the record, I have nothing against Nick Stahl, I think he is awesome, he just wasn't half the John that Ed Furlong was.
Posts: 2064 | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
I've just seen the first episode. Not a big fan so far.
Comparing this evil Terminator to Ahnold and Robert Patric kind of reminds me of the difference between the raptors in Jurassic Park 1 and 2. In their former incarnations they're terrifying, unstoppable killing machines that pursue their prey relentlessly and dispassionately, never wasting a moment that could be spent killing. Then in the sequels they get just close enough to the protagonist to create "suspense," at which point both the terminator and the raptors cock their heads to the side in a way that tries and fails to appear menacing, and then they wait for their prey to overcome them or escape.
I lost count of the number of times in the pilot that the terminator cocked his head to the side like a special-ed kid trying to solve a quadratic equation. If nothing else, it would make an excellent drinking game. I hope that whoever took the time and effort to program the head-cocking subroutine into his code is currently in the future-sentient-robot equivalent of the unemployment line.
Oh, and is "naked in the pilot" written into all of Summer Glau's TV series contracts? Not that I'm complaining, you understand... Posts: 2804 | Registered: May 2003
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posted
I think the head-cocking thing is a recall to T2. The T-1000 did it a lot, and it was annoying then but maybe not so clichéd.
Posts: 2849 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I am watching T2 right now and I think I have figured it out. Music! The show is missing the suspenseful music.
Posts: 2064 | Registered: Dec 2003
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They added little bits of the theme into the show, but you're right.
That and I don't think anyone can fill Linda Hamilton's shoes as Sarah Connor. I remember seeing her in T2 and thinking she was totally badass. I just don't get that impression yet with this new actress. She wears impractical little skirts and she's not as focused. Not implacable like she was in T2. But maybe that's because she thought the worst of the danger was past. I'll keep watching, but I'm not so impressed.
Posts: 2849 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I love that they named the FBI guy James Ellison. It's nice that they're giving the guy Terminator was stolen from some name credit.
Posts: 12266 | Registered: Jul 2005
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I chuckled when Cameron/Summer Glau told John "don't be a freak" when he wanted to save the girl committing suicide. He had been telling her not to get noticed, and then he was going to get noticed himself.
I also like the fact that they have kept her as a rather ruthless terminator. They tamed down Arnold quite a bit when John told him not to kill humans...Summer's terminator hasn't been tamed yet.
Posts: 1901 | Registered: May 2004
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posted
Why wouldn't she have with the suicidal girl in the bathroom, though?
Also... did it feel weird to anyone else that they did all that hinting about what she was so upset about, and then never did the big reveal?
Posts: 12266 | Registered: Jul 2005
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I would guess that the girl was simply not relevant to her mission of protecting John.
(i.e. she had to emulate humans pretty well to fool John who was potentially saavy to figuring out who she was. Now, she doesn't have to. The girl likely won't guess who she is no matter how bizarre she acts)
I thought the lack of a reveal was odd too, maybe cut for time. I just figured love triangle gone bad and someone was spray painting references to it around.
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