posted
It's not usually a question of "when does it seem okay," as far as I can tell. It's more a question of "when do I think I can get away with it." Which usually means "is she going to cause a scene or rationalize it away as an accident?"
TMedina, have you ever posted a picture anywhere? I gotta admit, you're one of the people who's physical appearance I'm curious about, at least partially because of how you describe yourself on occasion. If you're not a picturey type, I understand. Posts: 7954 | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
I used to not be a touchy feely person at all, and now I am, so I'll try to elaborate both sides.
When I wasn't a touchy feely person our neighbor across the street was, and she would always come up and hug me whenever she saw me. I didn't feel like she was invading my space, I felt like there was something wrong with me that I didn't like to be hugged. On her part, I think the hugging just came naturally, it wasn't something she thought about, it was just what you do when you're saying hi to someone. I doubt it even occured to her that people would be uncomfortable with it.
There was also a guy at my school who would give everyone backrubs and hugs whenever he saw them. This made me incredibly uncomfortable and eventually my boyfriend gave me the wonderful advice of telling him to stop, which definatly had not occurred to me before. I worked up the courage and told him and he stopped. Our relationship stayed just as odd and uncomfortable as it had always been.
Recently I've become much more of a touchy feely person. I hug my friends when they're upset and have begun to realize how much just holding someone can help when words don't have any affect. I can't imagine hugging someone I didn't know really well though. The only situation I can think of where I would is if I saw someone really upset and put an arm around them. I've never done that though, so I don't know if I actually would.
Posts: 4655 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
OK, let me clarify this...shen didn't hit me at all. I said I wasn't hitting on her, as in a sexual advance, or even being overly familiar with her person.
She just froze up, and her reaction as way out of proportion to what had happened, so I knew something was wrong.
No contact from her was what happened.....but if she HAD hit me I might have shoved her away or something. I don't react well to that sort of thing, I usually overeact. I wouldn't have intentionaly hit her back or hurt her, but it wouldn't have been a good thing, that was my point.
This is really not much help to Raia though, a she had the opposite problem...a man who wasn't aware of her reaction to his touching. I just strongly disagree with relying on violence, even a midl form of it, adn deception to deal with a situation that is best haldled with privacy and honesty. If that doesn't work htere is always other options, but I don't think they should be the first line of defence.
posted
I hope you weren't clarifying for me ...I just meant that if you read her body language that well when she froze up, I was thinking that you would have read her body language equally well if she actually had hit you instead. I just can't imagine you hitting her back, whatever her response was, even though you apparently can, at least a little bit.
Posts: 1990 | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
There's touching and then there's touching and the ability to set the standard of what is and is not acceptable depending on the situation and scenario.
Leaning in for a kiss after chatting with a complete stranger for a few minutes in a park is not acceptable.
Fishing for a kiss after a second date, maybe.
Kissing your wife before you leave for work, yes.
Some people might freak if you touched their shoulders, others think nothing of it.
It's a relative standard and depends entirely on the person in question.
posted
There's a guy at my church who seems to have trouble recognizing that people are bothered by certain behaviors. One of my friends has told him a few times not to touch her and he continues to do so. Fortunately, he hasn't done this to me. Actually, most people don't touch me uninvited, and I'm not sure why. I guess I give off "don't touch me" vibes. Oddly enough, I'm perfectly ok with touching during Aikido practice--being grabbed, having my wrists twisted, and being thrown to the ground--but a friendly pat on the shoulder from someone I don't know well, especially if the person is male, makes me uncomfortable.
But I digress. People seem to be ok with causing some pain if the person doing the touching has been warned verbally. But what can be done when my friends are clearly uncomfortable and have made their feelings clear to this person and he doesn't stop? I don't feel it's my place to beat him up the next time he does this, unless it's done to me. But it's gotten to the point where some of them are avoiding the college group activities because he's there.
Posts: 3546 | Registered: Jul 2002
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posted
I wasn't sure about what you were saying, so I wanted to clarify...my post made sense to me, but I already knew the story...
I don't think I would have hurt her, or hit her, btu I wouldn't want to be suprised like that and I am not sure waht my response would have been had she done so.
And I am a non-violent type of person.
When I was in 1st grade and I came home with a bloody lip and a black eye. When my dad saw me he was mad, and made me tell him what had happened.
A tomboy in my grade had started hitting me, and I couldn't hit her back....she was a girl! Once she found out I wouldn't hit back she beat the crap out of me.
So my dad pulled me aside and said that a man NEVER hits a lady....but that if a girl was beating me up and not letting me run away, she was no lady.
I beat the crap out of her the next day....after trying to get away and being chased down. Boy was she suprised!
I had a female principle, and she was pissed that I had hit a girl, and called my parents.
And my dad came in and told her off, and completely defended me and my actions. He said that if the school wasn't ging to do anything abotu a bully because she happened to be a girl, then I could fight back.
I will someday teach my children the same lesson....that violence is not an acceptable alternitive to discussion, or even flight...but that if it becomes necessay, do it right, against male or female.
I have only ever used that advice one other time, in junior high school. There was a HUGE girl who thought I wouldn't hit back because I was, in her words, a wuss. She began hitting me, and when I backed down, the teacher came in adn she blamed me. She had bee trying to throw my books out a window, adn when I reached for them she tries to push me out it (we were on the first floor), I looked at the teacher, and then I grabbed her and shoved her out the window and shut it. I figured fi I was going to get blamed for it all, I might as well do it and have the satisfaction. She was locked out, and the teacher took one look at me and said "Thank you Mr. Brill, I have wanted to do that to her since the school year began.".
The same argument saved me in that situation too.....
You NEVER hit a Lady, but if she is hitting you, she isn't a lady at all.
posted
'Almost in tears' Because this post keeps rolling. By now this is just about getting attention.
Posts: 117 | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
Umm... Jar Head, had you not noticed that the post had LLOOONNGG since moved on from the original topic and that Raia hasn't actually posted to it in a while. Its not about Raia anymore. Next time read before you open your big mouth.. or sould I say move your fingers.
Posts: 3295 | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Jar Head, if the thread bores you, don't read it. It's as simple as that. You don't have to be rude.
Posts: 1658 | Registered: Sep 2003
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Jar Head, thats not how it works around here. Threads often wander from topic to topic. Quit being an arsehole.
Posts: 3295 | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Most threads morph into something else after a while. If you don't like it, this is probably not the place for you.
Posts: 3546 | Registered: Jul 2002
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quote: 'Almost in tears' Because this post keeps rolling. By now this is just about getting attention.
This pisses me off. I could say a lot about that, but various people have already posted already. If you're going to be nothing but an immature idiot, I'm going to have to ask you to get the hell out of this thread.
posted
"I'm upset this thread is on the front page."
"I think I'll post to it, which makes it rise to the top of the page. And I'll say something so annoying I'll inspire others to reply, bumping it again and again."
I'll take "Posting Strategies That Make No Sense" for $2,000, Alex.
posted
Briefly back to what Tatiana mentioned. I did it once, only it was entirely gut reaction and I could not have stopped myself if I wanted to, which, in hindsight, I would not have wanted to.
I worked the graveyard shift at a hotel. One of the bellmen walked up behind me one morning and grabbed my butt. Full open hand grab, not a pinch. A total feel. I swung my elbow back as hard as I could. I hit him where it counts, he staggered into the back break room and stayed there for a good 45 minutes or so. I didn't apologize. We never talked about it. Where before, he had a reputation for being a sleazeball with the female staff, he competely changed overnight.
My boss called me in for a meeting one day shortly after to discuss this man. She wondered if I knew anything about his sudden change. I told her. She asked if I wanted the company to take any action against him for his sexual assault. Nah, I said. It's been dealt with.
Granted, my situation was a little different - it was fully sexual assault. But honestly, if someone touches me in a way that I'm not comfortable with, I tend to get mean and nasty fast. I hate being touched by people I'm not comfortable with. Hate. No one has the right to touch me, period. So many men just don't get it. Then again, so many women don't, either. And yes, it makes me look like a bitch. But I don't particularly care.
Posts: 8355 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
FWIW: I'm the type that will immediately react in a "bitchy" way when touched my someone I don't know well. I will do pretty much whatever it takes to get them to stop.
On my second day on the job as a waitress, a male coworker grabbed my ribcage to tickle it. His hands were in an iffy zone, in my opinion. It was technically my ribs, by dangerously close to my breasts. It's the place that a man will hold his significant other in public without being downright raunchy. Needless to say I've only ever been held there by one person, so my immediate feeling was an internal "He's not my husband!" and an external "Don't ever touch me again!" It was loud enough for the small restaurant to hear, and got me branded as a bitch.
I don't think a person should be blamed for most reactions they have in a situation like that, short of doing longterm damage. It's such an akward situation, and most women feel too small to do anything about it. I feel so sorry for girls who don't know how to handle it and just smile because they are afraid and confused. They always get blamed for "allowing it to happen" and leading the guy on, but that's bogus. Being touched by someone much bigger than you is scary! You'll do what you think won't get you hurt. Or sometimes it'll be a guy you like, but don't know too well. So when he crosses a line, you aren't sure if it's a good thing or a bad thing.
When I was younger, I would blush and get flustered and not really know what to do when someone was too forward, male or female. But things are different now. I will yell, punch, kick, or do whatever it takes to make sure people know where I'm coming from. I have created some heartache that was probably unnecessary but I don't really care. To me it's so important to be quick and clear and keeps me from dealing with anything like that more than once. I will always attempt verbal communication first, but if that doesn't work in one try I will then bring the guy down hard.
I am actually a very huggy person, but I reserve that for people I know well, and generally people who attempt to touch me first so that I know it will be well-received. I'm happier being a "bitch" and not being taken advantage of than being "nice" and having to deal with an overly-forward person more than once.
I can't fathom how a man could live in the United States in the year 2004 and not understand that he needs to tread lightly when it comes to touching women he doesn't know well. I just can not. With all the media coverage, and law suits, etc, I would expect men to be scared silly to come anywhere near an unfamiliar woman. So when men insist on hugging me, touching me, and complimenting me in a way that's too familiar (ie: A man in my church told me that he really liked my shirt because it kept him distracted, even though it was a fairly modest top), especially when I notice that they only do it when Jes isn't around, than I assume they are asking for it.
The compliment thing really ticks me off. It's like these guys think on how they can phrase something in a way that can be taken two ways, so that they can weasel out if it doesn't make you drool. It seems so purposeful.
posted
so, raia.... hows it goin'? Found the theripy/ womens/ health center or anything? Sorry to be so persistant about it... feel free to tell me to shut up I'll inderstand, its your choice after all .
Posts: 264 | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
Raia- I've been thinking of you and hope you are doing much better. I had something happen to me when I was 9 and never, to this day have I ever told anyone about it, not that that makes any difference. Just wanted to check and see how you were doing and let you know I was thinking of you. -Jennifer
Posts: 153 | Registered: Aug 2002
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posted
I can't add anything of import that hasn't already been said. I'm just chiming in to add my support and wish you well in your pursuit of (security)? Be cautious but be confident, and first and foremost, worry about you and your piece of mind before anything else.
Posts: 2022 | Registered: Mar 2004
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I've been thinking of you and hope you are doing much better. I had something happen to me when I was 9 and never, to this day have I ever told anyone about it, not that that makes any difference. Just wanted to check and see how you were doing and let you know I was thinking of you.
