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Author Topic: Heroes
Chris Bridges
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OK, season finale's tonight. Who's gonna die? Place yer bets!
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Christine
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I think Syler will die (or maybe I'm just hoping)
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BlackBlade
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One internet bucks says Nathan dies. Besides Sylar dying he is the only death.
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Dr Strangelove
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Alrighty, my call - Mama Patrelli dies, Peter blows, Sylar dies, and someone else is mortally wounded (maybe Hiro, maybe Ando).

Edit: Oh, and Nathan realizes he can't stop the bomb itself, but does somehow clear the city so that there is very little if any civilian death.

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His Savageness
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First post finale post!

Firstly, if Sylar isn't dead (and it seems to be looking like he's not) I'm going to be ANGRY. I wanted next season to focus on Molly's "worse" super villain.

Secondly, my prediction for season two based on the teaser: George Takai IS Kensei. He's also immortal. Discuss amongst yourselves.

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Luet13
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Wow. I did not see that coming at all. What an awesome way to save the world. I guess I had pretty much given up on Nathan, so it came as a shock to see him do the right thing.

And now I'm curious about that whole Hiro and the samurai thing at the very end there.

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Lisa
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I was really surprised when Niki knocked Candace out and she morphed back into the form we've seen her in before. I would have expected her to be grossly fat. She said she was fat last week, after all.
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SC Carver
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OK Why did Nathan have to die? (Not that I liked him any way) Why couldn't Peter just fly away, or teleport? He has been around both Nathan and Hiro before he should have been able to get himself out of town. If he was unable to, why would it be better for Peter to live than Nathan? Assuming Peter survives the blast. If it is not important for Peter to live, someone could have just shot him. I understand the whole redemption thing with Nathan, but I just didn't think it was necessary.

So Sylar got away. Why didn't Jessica or someone stop him, shoot him?

I love this series, but a couple of things didn't seem to be well thought out to me.

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Dr Strangelove
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I think maybe Sylar will become just another minion under this new villain.

Is it implied Peter is dead? I can take Nathan being dead, but I'd be mad if Peter is. I doubt he is, but shouldn't he have fallen to earth or something?

Once I saw the episode was going to sort of focus on Parkman I pegged him as the cliffhanger death.

Nice that Niki finally realized her strength.

Also nice that Peter started reading minds.

VERY nice to know Bennets first name. FINALLY.

And a very nice set up for next season. I don't think there's enough information to speculate on Peter's whole dream/reality sequence. It was very weird. But definitely set the stage for a series rather than just a show.

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Phanto
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I agree that Candance should have been fat. It would have added a extra level of emotional complexity to her. The end of Linderman was not optimal either in my opinion, though it was nice to at last see some security. And sheesh, Sylar should have died already.

It was cute to see Hiro finally be "bad-ass," and I was quite touched both by the ending monolog and the delightful quote from Molly: "Don't die, you're my hero."

The whole "We could be heroes" theme is one of the most moving aspect of this series and drives home that we are dealing with people here. I really liked the black guy with the deep voice, and I also liked Hiro's father -- as usual.

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SC Carver
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Dido on the fat thing.

I'm also getting tired of Sylar and would like to see the new even worse bad guy. "when i think about him he can see me" reminds me of Saraun from LOTR. The eye that never sleeps kind of thing.

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His Savageness
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Yeah. I've been thinking about Sylar's blood leading to the sewer, and I don't think he crawled, I think he was dragged.
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Dr Strangelove
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Carver, I figure that Peter is still alive, a bullet would have messed up his brain too much for repair so that would have killed him, and right now he can only use one power at a time. He really doesn't have that great of control over his powers (as is evidenced by the fact that he exploded). In the future I think he used two powers at once (telekenisis and invisibility) but so far I don't think he has.

Also, the whole Sylar = Cockroach thing is annoying. When Sylar was in captivity it showed him watching a cockroach, Mohinder says a cockroach is the most complete form of evolution or something at one point, and now at the very end there's a cockroach climbing over the manhole cover.

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His Savageness
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quote:
OK Why did Nathan have to die? (Not that I liked him any way) Why couldn't Peter just fly away, or teleport? He has been around both Nathan and Hiro before he should have been able to get himself out of town
I assumed that Peter couldn't fly or teleport because all his concentration was taken up trying to contain the nuclear power.

quote:
If he was unable to, why would it be better for Peter to live than Nathan?
Looking at it from a pure "which hero is the most useful" stance, Peter wins hands down.

[ May 21, 2007, 10:33 PM: Message edited by: His Savageness ]

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SC Carver
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Yea, I think Peter will still be alive, He is too good a character to kill off. One day he'll make superman look like a whimp.

They did seem to give Sylar a death scene.

What if Hiro's father isn't immortal, but has the same power as Hiro and has done a lot of traveling through time.

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His Savageness
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quote:
What if Hiro's father isn't immortal, but has the same power as Hiro and has done a lot of traveling through time.
That was my first thought, but I rejected it because up to now they've never had the children possess the same powers as the parents. It very well could be the case, though. I still maintain that his dad's Kensei. That looked like George Takai behind the mask.

Edited for grammar and spelling.

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ricree101
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quote:
Originally posted by His Savageness:
I still maintain that his dad's Kensei. That looked like George Takai behind the mask.

That is an interesting idea. It might also explain his general disapproval of Hiro. Given how much this whole journey has changed Hiro, it might have been hard for his dad to really connect that Hiro with the one he met in the past.

If this theory is true, I'm very interested in seeing exactly what the whole Kensei and the Dragon story is all about.

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BlackBlade
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Mama Petrelli already told Claire that she gave Peter the power to survive the blast.

The only reason to not just shoot Peter would be because Nathan could save Peter the REAL hero and thus allow him to come back.

Also I am really mad because I was thinking, "HA! Nathan and Sylar are dead, I totally called it!" Then I saw the manhole cover." [Frown] The way they have played Nathan's character completely sets him up for one last redemptive act in the future.

I also understood that Peter could not focus on stopping his explosive powers and at the same time fly away.

The problem I have with Sylar still being alive was that we clearly see his future sight flickering and showing him laying in a pool of blood dead, shouldn't we have seen a man hole cover or something like that in his eyes? Perhaps Savage is right and he was dragged there by the "boogey man."

Any ideas on what could be worse then Sylar?

When Peter went to work on Sylar I was VERY pleased, none of this power stuff, just good old fashioned duke bashing. Was Sylar too beat up to stop Hiro from rushing with his sword and stabbing him?

Also really good move giving Ando the sword before Hiro goes back in time to feudal Japan and has an identical sword to his ancestor.

I really have no idea where this series is going, but thus far the writing has pleased me alot, I hope they can pull a season 2 off! [Big Grin]

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ricree101
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You know, it's too bad that Peter died before he could get Linderman's power. I'm sure that one could really come in handy sometime in the future.
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Chris Bridges
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I was a little disappointed there wasn't more of an... epic... feel to the ending. If a couple of the heroes had, you know, attacked Sylar at the same time instead of stepping up one at a time, things would have moved along faster. As it was it was kinda sluggish and almost anticlimactic. Sylar has moved much faster, used more powers simultaneously before. Why was he so lame at the end? Satisfying ending, wasn't happy with the pacing.

Loved the preview of next season...

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KarlEd
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I coulda sworn the reality bending chick transformed into a dude when she got knocked out.

At any rate, she didn't say she was fat. The kid said, "You keep eating like that and you're gonna get fat", to which she replied, "How do you know I'm not?" At least that's how I remember it.

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BlackBlade
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Bridges:
I was a little disappointed there wasn't more of an... epic... feel to the ending. If a couple of the heroes had, you know, attacked Sylar at the same time instead of stepping up one at a time, things would have moved along faster. As it was it was kinda sluggish and almost anticlimactic. Sylar has moved much faster, used more powers simultaneously before. Why was he so lame at the end? Satisfying ending, wasn't happy with the pacing.

Loved the preview of next season...

Again it looks like initially Sylar was in total control, sending the bullets to Parkman, keeping Peter under control. But remember Niki is extremely strong (who knows, perhaps he paused to gauge if she had any powers) and Sylar has never met her or had a chance to size her up. I'm surprised Niki hitting him across the face with the parking meter did not kill him out right. I was under the impression that solid hit, combined with Peter's punches severely inhibited his ability to apply his powers.
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Blayne Bradley
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I'm fairly certain that Candice is female in her "true" form she appeared to lack a bulge as far as I can tell in the 3 seconds of hey lying there.

Hmm, I had always suspected that Hiro would be Kensai, but his dad being it also works, Hiro can simply be waiting there near by using his powers.

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Blayne Bradley
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Also I suspect Sylar liquified himself to be able to slip into the manhole and rconstitued himself once he was in.
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AvidReader
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After teasing us with a hint of how awesome a battle between Sylar and Peter could have been in the future episode, I was really disappointed with the actual fight. I guess they were making a point that Sylar's nothing without his powers.

I'm glad Niki finally figured out how to be Niki and Jessica at the same time. But what good did it do to hit Sylar once and then stand there with her husband the rest of the fight? She wasn't applying pressure to the wound. She wasn't getting him to safety. She was just standing there for the family portrait shots. What a waste.

But I'm thrilled that Ando didn't die. I thought Hiro would be the great Kensei, but I could be equally happy with his dad. After all, if the story about Kensei and the Dragon is for real, I'd rather see Dad go than Hiro.

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Lyrhawn
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That wasn't the same sword that Kensei had, Kensei's sword was snapped in two, and Takei brought Hiro a new family heirloom.

Interesting end to this episode. Sad to see Nathan go, if he is in fact dead, but clearly Sylar and Peter are still alive. Hard to gauge what will come next, but I think the new boogey man of Molly's will be interesting, and I think it's possible that Sylar could be his new minion, if Sylar were content to actually be a minion.

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Lisa
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quote:
Originally posted by KarlEd:
I coulda sworn the reality bending chick transformed into a dude when she got knocked out.

At any rate, she didn't say she was fat. The kid said, "You keep eating like that and you're gonna get fat", to which she replied, "How do you know I'm not?" At least that's how I remember it.

She said, "I am fat." And when she changed into the black woman to take him into the polling station, that's when she said, "How do you know this isn't my real form?"
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Lisa
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quote:
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
Also I suspect Sylar liquified himself to be able to slip into the manhole and rconstitued himself once he was in.

Sylar ate Alex Mack's brain.
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Lisa
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Who is "Shenkar"? Every friggin' episode had a thing in the credits that credited someone or other as "the voice of Shenkar".
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His Savageness
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quote:
She said, "I am fat." And when she changed into the black woman to take him into the polling station, that's when she said, "How do you know this isn't my real form?"
That's how I remember it as well. I too was disappointed that she wasn't fat. Or a little girl. I think it would have made her a very interesting character if she had ended up being Micah and Molly's age - it might help explain her seeming shallow naivety ("Mr. Linderman's gonna fix everything gosh golly!")
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Lyrhawn
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quote:
Originally posted by Lisa:
quote:
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
Also I suspect Sylar liquified himself to be able to slip into the manhole and rconstitued himself once he was in.

Sylar ate Alex Mack's brain.
I used to love that show when I was a kid.
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theCrowsWife
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quote:
Who is "Shenkar"? Every friggin' episode had a thing in the credits that credited someone or other as "the voice of Shenkar".
I was wondering that myself, but google told me this: "Shenkar is responsible for the vocalizations added to the opening credit music and transitions on the series Heroes. Originally known as Shankar, Shenkar is widely considered a living legend in the world of music. He often blends pop, hip hop, hock, soundtrack and world elements into his music."

From here.

--Mel

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Lyrhawn
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quote:
Originally posted by His Savageness:
quote:
She said, "I am fat." And when she changed into the black woman to take him into the polling station, that's when she said, "How do you know this isn't my real form?"
That's how I remember it as well. I too was disappointed that she wasn't fat. Or a little girl. I think it would have made her a very interesting character if she had ended up being Micah and Molly's age - it might help explain her seeming shallow naivety ("Mr. Linderman's gonna fix everything gosh golly!")
If her power really is bending light, it should be entirely a visual illusion, and not physical, which would mean when she punched Niki, if she were a child, physically she'd still be only a couple feet tall and very weak. Bending light wouldn't give her any added strength, there's no meat to her change, it's cosmetic.

One thing that I wondered...if Mama Petrelli, Charles Deveaux and Linderman were all allies...why didn't Linderman heal Charles?

PS, I watched the episode with a friend a few hours afterwards, and when Peter had his flashback/timetravel moment, I paused it, turned to my friend and said "Alright, he somehow unconciously traveled back in time and is invisible, but Charles' power is that he can see through it somehow, which is why WE can see him when we usually can't." And though we never got a firm answer on what happened, I think I hit pretty close to the mark. [Smile]

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His Savageness
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quote:
If her power really is bending light, it should be entirely a visual illusion, and not physical, which would mean when she punched Niki, if she were a child, physically she'd still be only a couple feet tall and very weak. Bending light wouldn't give her any added strength, there's no meat to her change, it's cosmetic.
This is a good point.

quote:
One thing that I wondered...if Mama Petrelli, Charles Deveaux and Linderman were all allies...why didn't Linderman heal Charles?
At the risk of being precious, maybe there are some things that even Linderman can't heal.
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Chris Bridges
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I blame the director for the lackluster ending. We should not have seen the various heroes gather themselves to attack. There was no suddenness, no urgency. We should have been with Sylar's point of view. The Armchair Director strikes!

SYLAR turns from flinging bullets back at PARKMAN and smiles at Peter.

"I'm the hero."

WHAM! Out of nowhere, NIKI smacks him with the post. SYLAR flies across the place. PETER collapses, gagging. SYLAR lands and looks up to see her coming after him with it; he GESTURES and she takes off. SYLAR rises up and steps towards PETER's still-coughing form when HIRO appears in front of him. SYLAR grabs at him but HIRO's gone already. SYLAR HEARS a rustle and moves to the left in time to avoid HIRO's sword coming at him from behind. SYLAR dodges wildly as HIRO pops in and out dozens of times, all around him, badgering him until, dazed, he faces PETER, who decks him thirty feet. SYLAR gets uop, shakes his head, and charges forward... just in time to get STABBED by HIRO. Pause for reaction -- first time the audience has had time to react -- and then he flings HIRO away and turns, wounded, to get WHALED ON by PETER. PETER's hero moment, as he gives SYLAR everything he has and wins, SYLAR falls, but PETER is overloading now and starts to glow.

PETER's anguish, everyone tries to help, no good. PETER tries to fly but convulses; if he uses another power he loses control of this one. There's a click and we see CLAIRE, holding the gun and crying. PETER begs her to do it, she starts to... and NATHAN SWOOPS in to grab PETER. He pauses just long enough to tell CLAIRE he loves her, then takes off.

NATHAN and PETER are flying high and fast now, and here we have their tender brother scene, high over the city, as PETER fights to get away from NATHAN.

All the same bits they used, but faster and more urgent.

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theCrowsWife
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*applauds*
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Blayne Bradley
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what is it with everyone and getting TV trivia wrong, Candice never once stated she was fat but more coyly implied it when she said "How do you know I'm not?" She never once said I am fat she only implied it. Also sylar ate what was his name? Zach Taylor? That person could liquify matter, so Sylar could do it to, Sylar when he grabs abilities always has better control over them then the people who originally had them, so not only could he posssibly liquify himself its also possible to unliquify.
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His Savageness
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quote:
Candice never once stated she was fat but more coyly implied it when she said "How do you know I'm not?" She never once said I am fat she only implied it.
I'll have to watch that episode again to be sure.

quote:
Also sylar ate what was his name? Zach Taylor? That person could liquify matter, so Sylar could do it to, Sylar when he grabs abilities always has better control over them then the people who originally had them, so not only could he posssibly liquify himself its also possible to unliquify.
For some reason I interpreted this power as the ability to liquefy metal, not necessarily any random matter. Did anybody else get the same vibe?
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Chris Bridges
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We only saw him liquefy metal. Sylar could have melted the manhole cover and slipped through, or someone could have dragged him off.
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theCrowsWife
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quote:
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
what is it with everyone and getting TV trivia wrong, Candice never once stated she was fat but more coyly implied it when she said "How do you know I'm not?" She never once said I am fat she only implied it.

No, she said it straight out.

MICAH: I have a cousin who eats like you. He's huge.

CANDACE: (laughs) So am I.

From the episode "Landslide" Part 3, 5:28.

--Mel

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Dr Strangelove
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I got the impression Linderman and Charles weren't on speaking terms. Maybe Linderman refused to heal him.

Does anyone else remember Hiro's dad saying something like "I have waited a long time for a Nakamura to ascend". That struck me as kind of odd at the time, but if he is immortal or at least very long living or something it would make sense.

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BlackBlade
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Chris: Your alternate way of fighting Sylar was certainly very interesting, I like it better. Perhaps they ran out of budget money by the finale? That would have been a very expensive and difficult scene to film.

Arm chair critic! Niki pulling out a parking meter would have certainly been heard by Sylar. Now that I think about it, his hearing ability really did not play out as much as I think it should have. He seems to just use telekinesis ALL the time, that and painting now that he has it.

Also if Peter is whaling on a stabbed and bleeding Sylar doesn't that seem kinda, I dunno pathetic? Its like saying you took out a terminally ill man.

Peter beating him up and Hiro finishing him off seems better, I dunno.

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Jon Paul Mosher
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Does anyone read the online novel? Does hana remind you of someone in the ender novels? Cough Jane Cough.......(:
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Angiomorphism
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Okay, about the Candace thing, I totally agree, she should have been fat, since she did reply "I am" to the comment about Micah's cousin being huge.

I don't necessarilly think Nathan is dead, because there is a pretty decent storyline involving people finding out the election was rigged and his newly healed wife to explore next season. I think it's entirely possible that the beginning of next season will show them both flying up, and Peter breaking free and Nathan escaping before he explodes.

I think Hiro's father is definetly immortal, and most likely Kensei. He has not shown any clear power, and has said that he has waited a long time for a Nakamura to ascend, which implies he's been around for a while, waiting for the right mutation in his lineage's genes. Also, he says that Hiro is the "wind behind history", implying he has some knowledge that Hiro is responsible for pushing history forward, maybe because he was there in the past when Hiro did just that.

I don't think Sylar is alive. I think the cockroach IS the new villain. Remember he was also present when Parkman was in the cell, and I bet if we look closely we will see him at other instances. It fits with Mohinder saying they are the evolutionary pinacle, and my guess would be that the cockroach uses Sylar's dead body as a host in the next season, which is why he was dragged away.

I'm torn over whether or not Parkman is dead.. He got like 4 bullets, but as "Mr. I got shot 9 times", 50cent, has shown us, he may still survive.

Also, I think the reason Nathan had to fly Peter up was that since he was overloading, his other powers weren't working, so if Claire had shot him, he would die for good. Letting him explode would be the only way to ensure he survives, and the only place he could do that safely was in the sky.. i.e. with Nathan.

I think Linderman didn't heal Simone's dad because he didn't want to be healed. He seemed pretty content with his impending death.

Some questions now.. Peter absorbed telekenesis from Sylar, does that mean he also has super-hearing, freezing, etc..? And he has 2 powers (possible 3 if Linderman wasn't lying about his dad being special, cuz the comics point to the opposite) that we don't know about, from Simone's dad and his mom.. any speculations?

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BlackBlade
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quote:
Some questions now.. Peter absorbed telekenesis from Sylar, does that mean he also has super-hearing, freezing, etc..? And he has 2 powers (possible 3 if Linderman wasn't lying about his dad being special, cuz the comics point to the opposite) that we don't know about, from Simone's dad and his mom.. any speculations?
Simone's father asked Mrs. Petrelli if either Nathan or Peter had manifest powers yet and she responded in the negative. Peter's powers of absorbtion could easily have just turned on one day, he does not have to have that ability the moment he was fully formed in the womb.
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Damien.m
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I dont think Nathan is dead. Its possible that once he was high enough to ensure that New York would be safe he let Peter go and flew away.
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Angiomorphism
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quote:
Originally posted by BlackBlade:
quote:
Some questions now.. Peter absorbed telekenesis from Sylar, does that mean he also has super-hearing, freezing, etc..? And he has 2 powers (possible 3 if Linderman wasn't lying about his dad being special, cuz the comics point to the opposite) that we don't know about, from Simone's dad and his mom.. any speculations?
Simone's father asked Mrs. Petrelli if either Nathan or Peter had manifest powers yet and she responded in the negative. Peter's powers of absorbtion could easily have just turned on one day, he does not have to have that ability the moment he was fully formed in the womb.
fair enough, but then he still has Mrs. Petrelli's and Simone's father's powers. And Sylar's other powers.
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BlackBlade
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I can't think far back enough. Did her father die before or after Peter started absorbing powers?

I agree he should have ALL of Sylar's powers that he had collected up until he fought him.

Perhaps that is what finally set Peter off, absorbing all those powers from Sylar.

Sylar: "YOU'RE THE VILLAIN PETER! I'M THE HERO!!"

Peter: "AHH MY EARS!! WHY ARE YOU SCREAMING SO LOUDLY!?!"

Sylar: "ACUTE HEARING ABILITY! I GOT IT ABOUT A WEEK AGO!!! DON'T WORRY YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONTROL IT IN A FEW DAYS!!!!

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Lyrhawn
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Given the radiation that Peter was giving off at that point, while I'd love to believe that Nathan could have survived, there's no way he wouldn't have had serious radiation sickness and died soon after anyways. Just sounds too implausible. Of all the characters that have died so far, Nathan's death has saddened me the most. It's always rough to watch a newly redeemed character sacrifice himself.

I think it was Zane Taylor, not Zach.

I liked the way it worked with Sylar and Peter's fight, and Hiro's help. I also like how it worked with Peter and Nathan. Not that I don't like a good brother/brother bonding before a self-sacrifice, but what really needed to be said? Nathan I think said it all just by showing up. Anything after that might have ruined it. I wouldn't have mind some more flashy lights and cool effects during the fight, something akin to what we say in the future episode.

I'd say Parkman is alive, I bet we find out later he was wearing a vest and only one bullet snuck through.

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Angiomorphism
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I kind of like the fact that the ending was a little anti-climactic. There was no intense music, no flashy effects. It was really just a straightforward (and rather short really) sequence, that, IMO, reflected well what would have happened in reality. That is afterall what the show is trying to portray...
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