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» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Books, Films, Food and Culture » Lost Season 3 Discussion - Spoilers Galore! (Page 8)

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Author Topic: Lost Season 3 Discussion - Spoilers Galore!
The Rabbit
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quote:
Originally posted by Leonide:
I can't list any examples, but there have been numerous episodes where it seemed suggested (to me) that the characters were remembering the particular flashbacks at the same time as we the audience were watching them...

But thinking about a past event isn't the same as experiencing a flashback. Desmond talked about his life "flashing before his eyes" and how the "flashes" keep happening. That is something very different from thinking about an event in your past.
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The Rabbit
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quote:
Originally posted by Strider:
quote:
There is nothing in the way the episodes are organized which would suggest the characters themselves are experiencing flashbacks.
I never thought so either, but Desmond's flashback has made me change my mind. Like I said, it would go a long way to explaining how and why some of the Losties see halucinations on the island that are DIRECTLY related to the flashbacks that are shown for them.

I suppose it could be that everyone on the island is having flashbacks but I think that as of yet there is little evidence to suggest it. We know that people see things from their past on their island but we don't know whether they are halucinations or some manifestation from the island. In contrast, there just isn't any evidence that anyone but Desmond has had a flashback. We've never seen anyone zone out prior to one of the past episodes nor have we ever seen anyone wake up following a past episode nor has there been any other indication that the losties are having flashbacks.

Like I said, its possible. There isn't any evidence that contradicts it, there just isn't any evidence for it either.

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Strider
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No comments on last nights episode?

Surprising since I thought it was infinitely better than the previous week's. I was actually really happy with last night's episode. I've said it before, but I really miss the interaction of all the characters, and last night I figured out why. You can always count on certain characters for something. Hurley always gives some much needed levity. Sayid is always very practical and getting information and making plans. Locke is similar, except has more faith in the mystery of the Island. And so on, each character serves a different purpose on that show, and when they are all together interacting, you get all these different elements in one episode.

Anyway, I really enjoyed the episode. And I'm psyched for next week.

Though I did think it was pretty out of character for Kate to not talk to someone like Sayid for help before taking off to find Rousseau herself.

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Elizabeth
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I loved the VW bus sequence.

I have a friend who si a bus lover, and I refer to it as a "bus." He is always working on it, always. It is always breaking down. So I had to let him know that I had seen one in much better shape than his.

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The Pixiest
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"You found yourself a Hippy Car!"
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Elizabeth
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Well, for my friend, it is just a car.
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Elizabeth
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Wow.
They didn;t just play a song:

http://www.dreamscape.com/morgana/juliet2.htm

"Is there really a hidden galaxy of minds living in seclusion in an inaccessible part of Asia, or is it merely a myth? Shambhala, the "Hidden Kingdom," is thought of in Tibet as a community where perfect and semiperfect beings live and are guiding the evolution of humankind. Shambhala is considered to be the source of the Kalacakra, which is the highest and most esoteric branch of Tibetan mysticism. The Buddha preached the teachings of the Kalacakra to an assembly of holy men in southern India. Afterwards, the teachings remained hidden for 1,000 years until an Indian yogi-scholar went in search of Shambhala and was initiated into the teachings by a holy man he met along the way. The Kalacakra then remained in India until it made its way to Tibet in 1026. Since then the concept of Shambhala has been widely known in Tibet, and Tibetans have been studying the Kalacakra for the least 900 years, learning its science, practicing its meditation, and using its system of astrology to guide their lives. As one Tibetan lama put it, how could Shambhala be the source of something which has affected so many areas of Tibetan life for so long and yet not exist?"

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Elizabeth
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Here's another snip from the above link:

"By definition Shambhala is hidden. It is thought to exist somewhere between the Gobi Desert and the Himalayas, but it is protected by a psychic barrier so that no one can find the kingdom who is not meant to."

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pfresh85
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To be honest, while I enjoyed the episode I didn't like it as much as other ones. Of course, my interests in Lost relate to DHARMA and the Others and not the people on the beach as much anymore. To me, next week looks like a really exciting episode. The eye-patch man returns! Fun!
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Elizabeth
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Hmm.
Dharma.
Tibetan lost kingdom(Shambala=Shangrila)

(I am sure this is not a revelation, but hey.

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The Reader
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That was a great episode. Nothing advanced, except our knowledge of Hurley's relationship with his father, but it was fun. That was needed at this point.

I can't wait for one-eye to reappear. This should be good, but I won't get my hopes up.

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kojabu
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The fact that nothing advanced disappointed me. I hate it when TV shows advertise something as being big and huge and exciting and then it turns out to be a hippie car.
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Frisco
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You forgot the beer. [Razz]

Loved the episode. It seems like every day on the island is field trip day. I mean, can't we just take a day and relax? [Razz]

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Reshpeckobiggle
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Sawyer is my favorite.

"Beer... Car..."
Points to Hurley... "International House of Pancakes!"

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Launchywiggin
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The van would have tipped over in the first 5 seconds.
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The Reader
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This is television, Launchy. In real life the plane probably would not have crashed, and entities like Dharma can't go unnoticed for more than a few years (Area 51, for example).
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Launchywiggin
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See, we know there are supernatural things going on in the series. Thus, I can ignore the big things like the plane crash because there is clearly something supernatural that allowed them to live and that is hiding the island. The little things--like the fact that the van was bouncing so wildly that it would have lost control and tipped--that just takes me out of the story. You see what I mean? I can deal with the car magically starting, but when you show the van about to lose control, then cut to another angle and another take, and do it repeatedly...well you see what I mean.
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Elizabeth
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The tires would have been flat.
The gas would have leaked out through a rusted tank.
The beer? I don;t even want to think about it!
Etc.
I don't care, I loved it.

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sweetbaboo
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I thought Sawyer was a crack up this episode as well. When he called the corpse "Skelletor" I had tears in my eyes.

[ March 03, 2007, 09:36 AM: Message edited by: sweetbaboo ]

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The Reader
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quote:
Originally posted by Launchywiggin:
See, we know there are supernatural things going on in the series. Thus, I can ignore the big things like the plane crash because there is clearly something supernatural that allowed them to live and that is hiding the island. The little things--like the fact that the van was bouncing so wildly that it would have lost control and tipped--that just takes me out of the story. You see what I mean? I can deal with the car magically starting, but when you show the van about to lose control, then cut to another angle and another take, and do it repeatedly...well you see what I mean.

We don't know that there are supernatural things going on. This has never been explained well enough, at least for me. Are we just supposed to assume that the geomagnetic anomoly and the smoke are supernatural? Maybe they were man-made. The smoke could be a ghost, or it could be an extremely advanced carbon-fiber machine.

And I think that a car can get started if it is roll it down a hill. It isn't much different from the old hand cranks. Heck, maybe the car was planted and made to appear old.

I don't think the writers know what they want to do. The show is entertaining, but I'm tired of be jerked around.

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Strider
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This is pretty cool.
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pfresh85
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That was pretty cool. I was quite impressed. I wish I was that good with Photoshop.
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Strider
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rough translation of conversation between the russian and the black lady:

...

You know what you have to do.

there's another way

no. you have to do it.

no, we can get out of this.

you know the protocol, you have to do this. do it now.

...

the last thing he says is "forgive me".

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pfresh85
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Ah. That was what I was thinking they were saying (or close to it), particularly from their expression and what happened. So that works.

I'm interested in this alarm system in next week's episode. Looks interesting (particularly what Locke does with the prisoner).

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Dav
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Did Sayid really torture that woman, or was he just admitting it to stop his own beating? My impression is that his confession to her was real, but I'm not sure. I didn't see seasons one or two, so I'm guessing there's some backstory I haven't seen that is relevant.
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Launchywiggin
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I would have liked it if they had explained that, too. Maybe Sayid was blocking his memory of the woman, and it came back to him with her story.

I was very confused by the actions of eyepatch-man. From shooting, to helping, to fighting again. What did Sayid say that gave it away that he knew eyepatch was lying?

Why is it protocol to kill the black woman?

Double-U. Tee. Eff.

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pfresh85
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I think it was the fact that Sayid was deliberately provoking eyepatch that gave it away. The whole "well, at least we got to kill one of them" was definitely him trying to rile up eyepatch. Eyepatch knew at that point that the jig was for sure up, so why keep it up then?
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Launchywiggin
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Right--that makes sense now. Thanks pfresh.

I love that you have to win the chess game to log into the Dharma system. I'm a big chess geek.

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The Reader
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I was hoping that they would save a few Dharma manuals. They need new reading material, but Playboys probably never get old for people on a deserted island.

In next weeks promo, it looked like Sayid tried to kill Eyepatch (He had a name, what was it?) by throwing him through the alarm system. Promos are slightly misleading though. I think there is some advantage for them to keep the guy, maybe for a prisoner exchange.

And if none of the communication equipment worked, why did he stay the Flame Station? Food production?

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pfresh85
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I thought it was Locke who was trying to kill Eyepatch (whose name I think is Mikail, spelling?), as I swear I heard Sayid yell "John! No!" or something like that.

As for the Flame Station, maybe the communication stuff did work and Eyepatch just lied about it. It's hard to say how much truth he was telling. Also there could have been something else of importance there that we didn't see (maybe a communication point between all the stations or different areas of the island or something?).

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Counter Bean
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If it is a juncture of all the big cables then the power for the 'others' enclave is most likely compromised now. Also the 77 code will most likely end the shipments from the outside world with some sort of hard signal, a dead man switch or something.

I think the settlers are well and truly screwed by this turn of events. More then that they are stupid. They do not have the numbers on the island to play a game of attrition.

To me it looked like Sayid spotted the security sensor and then the patch guy ran to trigger it. Another of those better to die then give up the all important secret moments.

My interest is in the way that the plane crash people have settled into a rather altruistic communal sharing situation. Easy enough of course with regular food shipments but I imagine things might get capitalistic again once it is dog eat pig again.

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Frisco
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I think the "Hostiles" are just another part of the Dharma setup. [Razz]

And in the preview for next week, it seems like Eyepatch is trying to kill himself on the "fence" and John is trying to stop him.

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pfresh85
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Yeah, I think you're right, Frisco. I went to Youtube and rewatched the preview. It does look like Eyepatch is trying to kill himself, Locke grabs his collar but loses hold, the guy runs into the "fence."
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The Reader
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quote:
Originally posted by CounterBean: My interest is in the way that the plane crash people have settled into a rather altruistic communal sharing situation. Easy enough of course with regular food shipments but I imagine things might get capitalistic again once it is dog eat pig again.
And Sawyer will be the guy everyone looks to for help, unless other survivors try to compete. If a few other people do compete, then the whole group may settle in to a capitalistic pacifism because they won't have to rely on ruthless Sawyer. Unless The Others (or is it Hostiles now?) attempt an attack.

quote:
Originally posted by Frisco: I think the "Hostiles" are just another part of the Dharma setup.
Hey, why not? This trickery strategy was already tried with the Swan station being watched by that other station. (Argh, there are too many names to remember right now.)
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Fitz
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No comments about last night's episode? I thought it was pretty boring, especially after the last few episodes have been good.

Despite that, one big revelation, that being that Jack and Claire are brother and sister. This kinda bugs me. It seems a lot like one of those "let's keep heaping on the mysteries" moments. Maybe it will play out into something good, but I seriously doubt that this was planned from day one, and that makes me doubt the overall vision of the writers.

Next week's episode looks good!

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Scott R
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I thought the writing for the last two episodes has been terrible.

Claire's rant at the end, in her mother's hospital room, was particularly awful. Like, After-School-Special awful.

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Bokonon
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See, I don't mind, because I think one of the main premises of the show is that coincidences abound. I'm also more intrigued in Locke, which works well considering the subject of next week's episode.

As for the sibling thing, it's been planned for a while. There was a flashback (my wife thinks in a Sawyer episode) of Jack's dad going to what looked like the aunt's house right on his last drunken trip back to Australia. It was in the rain, IIRC.

-Bok

EDIT: It looks like it was an episode from last season, and it was Claire's mom (still might be the aunt).

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pfresh85
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Really? This was the boring one for you? I found it boring initially, but once we got past the Charlie/Claire blah-fest at the beginning it was pretty good. Then again, I'm more interested in the bizarre elements of the show (the Others, DHARMA, and even Desmond's visions). I want to be away from the beach more, so that way I get to know more about the mysteries.

I do agree with you about next week's episode though. A Locke-centric episode is usually good anyways. One that involves possibly explaining how he is no longer paralyzed and that shows him (at least to some extent) invading the Others' main home area looks to be awesome.

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Strider
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quote:
Maybe it will play out into something good, but I seriously doubt that this was planned from day one, and that makes me doubt the overall vision of the writers.
Bok is right, and I seem to recall us all theorizing right away that Claire was most likely Jack's sister. So this really came as no big surprise. The only thing I find interesting about it is that Claire actually met him and knows what he looks like, so I'm sure at some point it'll all come out somehow.

quote:
A Locke-centric episode is usually good anyways. One that involves possibly explaining how he is no longer paralyzed
I'm pretty sure we know that pfresh, it was the island. The bigger question is how he BECAME paralyzed in the first place. I'm also curious as to whether eye patch man actually knew Locke from the past, or was just commenting on the fact that he knew Locke was paralyzed. maybe we'll find out next week.
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Fitz
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Yeah, but what really happened? They found a trap, they got over it, they found the Other's camp. Well, I knew that was going to happen last week. I thought the only interesting part of the Locke/Kate/Sayid storyline was that we got a better idea of Locke's reasons for finding the Others.

The whole beach part of the episode sucked royally. Nothing new in the Desmond/Charlie storyline, it was just there for the purpose of including Claire in the episode so that they could do her flashback.

Edit: That reply is to pfresh. As for Claire and Jack being related, this is the first I've heard of it, but that's no big surprise. I haven't really been paying attention to all the speculation. I like the show, but keeping track of everything has gone beyond my caring.

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pfresh85
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Well, we know it's something about the island, but we don't know what. I mean originally there was speculation that it was the electro-magnetic aspects being controlled by the hatch. Now with that blown, he's still okay. So it's something else. The fact that Eyepatch mentioned that "the John Locke I know is paraly-" seems to say to me that maybe it'll be addressed. I understand though that we will see how he became paralyzed in the first place (particularly since we see Ben mentioning it). I'm more interested in the former than the latter though.

As for what happened, the stuff that interested me was Eyepatch explaining the list a little better (or at least defining a little more why some people are on the list and why others aren't). Also we saw Jack being integrated into the Others at their camp, rather than being held hostage. Add to that the Locke stuff (Locke had some good lines last night), and I was fine with the episode.

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Launchywiggin
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Question:

is anyone else tiring of the flashback formula?

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Bokonon
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Not when it's done well, and it's interesting.

The alternative is a half-hour show.

-Bok

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Lisa
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They'll show us how he got paralyzed, but I kind of doubt they'll explain how he got un-paralyzed.

This episode was great, I thought. Next week looks to be even better. They're finally showing us stuff. One reveal a season was nuts.

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Frisco
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The problem I had with the episode was the contrived conflict between Sayid and Locke. Totally out of character for both of them, I think.

That, and the whole controversy with Charlie and the bird. Didn't seem realistic.

I did like that we found the Others' camp and saw Jack...enjoying himself.

Claire being his sister has been speculated at for a while now.

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Reshpeckobiggle
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Where are the black people? Walt and his dad are gone, Ecko is dead, and the woman with the dentist husband, it's like she never even existed. Did she die? I forgot. They must have done some market research and found that black people don't watch Lost. Sure as hell probably aren't going to start now.

So the minority count is basically Sayid, Hurley... and I guess there's probably a Canadian or two running around the island.

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Puffy Treat
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quote:
Originally posted by Reshpeckobiggle:
the woman with the dentist husband, it's like she never even existed. Did she die? I forgot.

The actress who plays Rose is not a regular cast member, and I seem to recall her saying that she doesn't wish to be be. I could be wrong.

The actor who played Mr. Eko left because of the recent death of his parents and a desire to re-direct his life. (There are rumors he also didn't get along too well with the rest of the cast)

Walt is gone most likely because of the age problem...he's growing up fast.

Though I wouldn't say we'll never see him or his father again.

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Reshpeckobiggle
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No, I just think it's a White conspiracy. Or a Canadian conspiracy.
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The Rabbit
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quote:
Originally posted by Frisco:
Claire being his sister has been speculated at for a while now.

I don't know what's "been speculated", but last season in the flashback episode where Ana Lucia is acting as Jack's father's body guard in Australia, he wakes Ana Lucia in the middle of the night and has her drive him to a woman's house. A blond woman, who we now know as Claire's aunt, comes to the door and he demands that she tell him where his daughter is. She refuses and so Ana Lucia drops him at the bar where he meets Sawyer. Following that episode, I predicted that Claire would turn out to be the daughter.

A point was made in this weeks show that Claire never learned her father's name even though she met him. That will make it difficult for her to make the connection to Jack unless a picture of Jack's dad happens to be floating around the island somewhere.

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Reshpeckobiggle
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What if they hooked up? You know, Merry the Hobbit dies and Claire goes to Jack for consolation... just like in Star Wars, when Leia kisses Luke!!! Then Jack's dad shows up: "Claire, I'm your Father!"
Jack: "KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAN!!!!!!"

Hmmm, I got confused.

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